Poor man's watch thread

[am55]



Sorry, but I just struggle to see any rational justification for buying something that is demonstrable junk, regardless of price, aesthetics or features.  Junk is junk.  It doesn't become more appealing because you can buy quite a lot of junk for not a lot of money.  That's how I see it.  Others, of course, may see it differently. 

Well, I disagree with you on the junk part. A new Seiko 5 may last a while, but these have lasted decades probably without maintenance and still run fine (in half the cases) with a sleeker, more thought out design, without the rattling sound and tons of space for the tolerances (between hands, in the mechanism, etc.) and things like folded sheet metal bracelets or soft scratch prone metal (the HMT casing, although not the screw lid, is made of a hard steel that is quite scratch resistant). Certainly the finish is neater than many Rodinas I've seen, and the movement fully jewelled. This is not just my opinion but that you can find on various watch forums.

I also personally (functionally) prefer a curved acrylic crystal to a straight mineral crystal in a case with higher walls, because it does not catch as easily on shirt cuffs, although I understand on this point if you think differently, as it is a matter of taste.

Finally, I suspect the broken ones are so because of bad (or no) maintenance and HMT's reputation for crap QC rather than inherent quality issues in the design itself (i.e. the good ones are good). In particular it is easy to ruin the mechanism around the stem by not depressing the "I'm taking the stem out" button next to it with a pin when you take it out before taking the movement out, and to bend the stem by misaligning it with the case hole when you replace the movement.

Today's (very sunny):

A few days ago:

 

[am55]



I have purchased a handful of seikos and citizens from this seller, all of which were below $20 shipped, and have clean movements. Some of his listings may have oxidized hands or faces, but he has many examples that are in good condition (some of these may be fantasy / frankenwatches, assembled into a configuration that was never a factory release) that would easily rival most HMTs I have seen (especailly the sunburst / metallic dial seikos / citizens). Examples:

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

http://www.ebay.com/usr/seiko200?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2754 He also has no-date seikos and citizens in a plainer, more HMT like appearance. I picked up both of these citizens from another seller in NOS condition for $30 each, hand wound no date. Im actually letting them go if anyone wants them:

The Russians make watches that are mechanically on par with most swiss and japanese counterparts. You can easily snag a vintage Raketa, Luch, Vostok, or Poljot dress watch in a hand winding caliber like the 2209 (the thinnest movement in the world at the time) that will be time tested, high functioning, and classy in proportion. They are engineering and finished to a much higher standard than HMT. Myriad examples exist (in several other calibers as well, such as the 2609). Vintage russian dress watches are probably the best deal in hand wound mechanical dress watches today. They can be had under $40 easily:

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

The Luch 2209 equipped models are probably the best period dress watches (sized 34-36mm):

Thanks for the Seiko seller recommendation. I'll check him out next time I need to scratch that itch. I respectively disagree that the examples you give are superior in design to the HMTs, I prefer the finer features of the HMTs and their more interesting and balanced sense of proportions. But these things are a matter of taste, like wearing brown bluchers with a tie, I do not accept that there are "objective" answers there. I personally have not seen an affordable Luch 2209 with an attractive dial (the notched metallic ones for example) for years. Maybe even a decade. My last Luch (that wasn't stolen from a break in my flat in the late 2000s) had a deformed crystal, bumpier on one end, and the stem sheared off during winding after just a few wears. Maybe I'm a bad eBayer.

 

[RogerP]

If 4 out of 7 watches are in a state of partial or complete failure in a couple months, that's junk in my books. I get the feeling that if they all broke you'd still be defending them, though. So I guess we can agree that we just have very different ideas about both watches and junk.

 

[am55]



If 4 out of 7 watches are in a state of partial or complete failure in a couple months, that's junk in my books. I get the feeling that if they all broke you'd still be defending them, though. So I guess we can agree that we just have very different ideas about both watches and junk.

If the remaining 3 break within 6 months, I promise to admit you were right and I was wrong. I don't promise to remember to post on the thread but it is likely I will be annoyed enough to do so.

 

[bbconair]

i have a nice watch, but need to replace the bracelet / strap. previously had a leather strap and an alligator strap, but no longer interested in spending a few hundred on a strap.

anyone have recommendations for where to get cheap, decent-quality, leather straps? i was thinking that kickstarter, or etsy, should be able to offer these types of goods since they're kind of commodities (in my eyes).

any ideas?

 

[tifosi]



i have a nice watch, but need to replace the bracelet / strap. previously had a leather strap and an alligator strap, but no longer interested in spending a few hundred on a strap.

anyone have recommendations for where to get cheap, decent-quality, leather straps? i was thinking that kickstarter, or etsy, should be able to offer these types of goods since they're kind of commodities (in my eyes).

any ideas? 

I would check into Hirsch brand. They offer great quality and reasonable costs. Hadley Roma as well.

 

[am55]



i have a nice watch, but need to replace the bracelet / strap. previously had a leather strap and an alligator strap, but no longer interested in spending a few hundred on a strap.

anyone have recommendations for where to get cheap, decent-quality, leather straps? i was thinking that kickstarter, or etsy, should be able to offer these types of goods since they're kind of commodities (in my eyes).

any ideas? 

If you want to branch away from cow: I'm happy with my Vietnamese croc and Thai lizard from eBay. $20-30 for the first and $10-20 for the second. The Vietnamese sellers really give you a broad range of options from all parts of the animal (including some of dubious taste such as the fingers). Belly leather is the softest and has the most symmetrical and square scales, the back does give a rugged feel, there's a few sellers doing hornback ridges if that is your thing. I would caution against overlapping scales which look interesting but have soft-ish edges.

(Monitor) lizard is a bit thicker than leather and with a shinier appearance, but still thin and supple, quite good for dressier watches.

Cow-wise I'm happy with my David Boettcher strap (http://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/customers.php). The fit is perfect, the stitches tidy, the strap solid and very comfortable. Beware a tight fit if going for a NATO or RAF, as he likes using a full 2mm of leather on the strap.

 

[bamgrinus]

If you want to branch away from cow: I'm happy with my Vietnamese croc and Thai lizard from eBay. $20-30 for the first and $10-20 for the second. The Vietnamese sellers really give you a broad range of options from all parts of the animal (including some of dubious taste such as the fingers). Belly leather is the softest and has the most symmetrical and square scales, the back does give a rugged feel, there's a few sellers doing hornback ridges if that is your thing. I would caution against overlapping scales which look interesting but have soft-ish edges.

Any specific sellers to recommend?

 

[sliq]



Any specific sellers to recommend?

+1

 

[Jazzmenco]

 

[mosy]

I really like this watch. However the size of the "MIDO" bothers me a bit. It seems significantly more prominent than any other respectable brand I can think of. Would love to get some thoughts from the experts here.
Thanks in advance!

 

[DerangedGoose]

Its not bad. Ruined by the date window though

 

[mosy]



Its not bad. Ruined by the date window though

The date window doesn't bother me. However I don't think I've come across any other watch brand who's name is so big and legible from such a distance.
Here's a comparison shot:

 

[am55]

As requested, croc and lizard from ASEAN:

http://www.ebay.com/usr/best_buy_asia?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2754 for lizard, here's a photo:

It's honestly hard to capture it in a photo (and I think the seller does a better job than me) but the leather is both thinner than croc, and more solid and premium looking (to me) than leather, thanks to its shiny appearance (which is different from plastic or pleather). If you have ever seen snakes or shinier reptiles you will understand what I mean. It's a dry and supple strap ideal for dress watches. I'd only return to unlined calfskin for a true ultra thin watch like the Altiplano (and I think croc belly can achieve the same thickness and suppleness).

The seller for this one (http://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/vydzua) was the most expensive of the 3 Vietnamese croc stores:

at about $10 more than the cheapest per strap. The stitches are almost invisible and quite tidy. This is a stiff strap due to the thickness of the skin, but I wear it all the time and it has moulded to my wrist after a couple of weeks, as you can see it arches even when opened. The strap was already antiqued when I bought it. I have not maintained the leather in any way and you can see the creasing where the buckle rubs against the strap. I should probably do something about it. The pieces are quite unique, the antiqued dark brown I haven't found elsewhere. This is the Berluti of Vietnamese croc straps.

http://www.ebay.com/usr/vnhandcraftart is a bit rougher, which I think works for more casual straps. The stitches are longer, but parallel and neat (to the extent that is allowed by the scales). I picked very large scales as an experiment, I quite like it, but you can see how it gives the strap a sort of angular shape due to the difference in stiffness between joints and scales:

This makes this seller the C&J of Vietnamese croc straps. I also wouldn't buy a red strap again as it looks too feminine; as it gets older, I'm sure it will darken into an acceptable burgundy.

I have two straps from http://www.ebay.com/usr/anhtuantom1. The second one had one side at 19mm instead of 18mm, and with some visual damage to the scales, maybe 5mm long scratches that really destroyed the impression that a nice belly strap gives of neatness and elegance (belly is soft and thin, with the most even pattern). The first one had overlapping scales and I was relatively happy with it but I rarely wear it as it is a bit too edgy and unique for me. This seller had the most exciting selection of "crocodile parts" before he shut down his shop. Between the fun selection and not amazing QC, this seller is the Meermin of Vietnamese croc straps. The best I can do is show you "recommended items from this seller" from my confirmation email since he took everything offline:

As you can see he gets creative, many of the straps were similar and there seems to be a small following on the internet for matching these experiments with more aggressive divers.

 

[RogerP]

Cool vintage chronograph with a legit space pedigree. Column wheel in-house movement. Not to mention arguably THE first automatic chronograph brought to market. Zenith clings to the "El Primero" claim mostly by ignoring the existence of Japanese watches.

6139-6002 Pogue