Is becoming a lawyer a mistake?

[Radagast]

..

 

[arirang]

Probably not. As one of the posters on the front page has indicated, it is too much of a buyer's market.

I am in Canada and I was lucky enough to get my law degree a few years ago when tuition fees were under $5,000, and as a result I have no debt. If I had $100,000 in debt I'd probably have been forced to stay at a firm to earn enough money to pay it off. Trouble is that I didn't really enjoy that environment, so I left for another legal job which pays less but affords a better lifestyle overall IMO.

Law school is still a good bet for someone who is a balls to the wall, type-A workaholic, but then that kind pf person will succeed anywhere. It is also a good bet for someone who truly, truly loves legal scholarship, but out of the 150 or so people in my graduating class I doubt more than 10% fit that category.

There are barriers to entering the legal profession which would make you think it is a lucrative place to be, but there are so many law schools throughout North America that the market simply cannot absorb all of the new lawyers being minted each year. While the best of best get the royal treatment and the "pretty good" students make a good living, that leaves huge numbers of people who muddle by or leave the profession altogether.

Trying something and deciding it isn't for you is not the worst thing in the world, but it would suck after three years of working hard at school and incurring a massive debt in the process, and then working for peanuts for the first couple of years at a law firm.

I would not tell anyone to avoid law school at all costs, but be very careful before making the decision. Caveat emptor.

 

[AR_Six]

^Screw you, I graduated from UBC Law and my debt is like 40,000 dollars. Fortunately I'm liking the big firm environment a lot, largely as a result of a good fit and the right people around me. Course I haven't been here all that long. Also I agree with your advice in general.

 

[rajesh06]

Not a lawyer - but have done some expert witness work in my career. Found the whole process to be fascinating and adrenaline-filled. Money aside, some people would enjoy this - but not everyone.

 

[rjakapeanut]

Originally Posted by Flambeur

You are young and naive.
young, sure. naive? i'd love to hear your reasoning. then again i know this is the internet and you're allowed to pop in and shoot nonsensical comments at people without explanation. but i've never been a big fan of that.

Originally Posted by Radagast

I envy people in your position. I know a couple people who say they've known pretty much exactly what they wanted to do for a living since childhood. I never had that. Plop down a list of careers in front of me and ask me which ones I could do for a couple of years and i'll check off a good chunk of the list. Now ask me to just pick one to do for the rest of my life and I've got no idea. Basically, a lot of things look good to me, nothing looks singularly great.
i'm probably one of those people. but my big point is i can definitely tell you what i absolutely know i DON'T want to do. as far as professional paths such as MD or JD etc....i think people gravitate towards those careers because of the prestige/$$$...and there's definitely a ton more than that to consider. the money isn't as good as people say, and even if it is will you enjoy the job? for how long? will success come easy? atleast easy enough for you to manage? i will go into law, but it's because i've done several years of research. not only reading, researching, but actually talking to lawyers. watching lawyers. observing their craft, in all different fields. it's just a slap in the face when people go "eh i'll just go to law school." they'll end up failing. usually.

 

[clee1982]

Originally Posted by rjakapeanut

young, sure. naive? i'd love to hear your reasoning.

then again i know this is the internet and you're allowed to pop in and shoot nonsensical comments at people without explanation.

but i've never been a big fan of that.



i'm probably one of those people. but my big point is i can definitely tell you what i absolutely know i DON'T want to do.

as far as professional paths such as MD or JD etc....i think people gravitate towards those careers because of the prestige/$$$...and there's definitely a ton more than that to consider. the money isn't as good as people say, and even if it is will you enjoy the job? for how long? will success come easy? atleast easy enough for you to manage?

i will go into law, but it's because i've done several years of research. not only reading, researching, but actually talking to lawyers. watching lawyers. observing their craft, in all different fields.

it's just a slap in the face when people go "eh i'll just go to law school." they'll end up failing. usually.

I was on my path to phd, and I was also thinking phd, big deal. Well, then a girl comes to my life and wack everything all around, and now I have been working in finance for 3 years, don't ever be so sure about your life my friends...

I never intend to stay in US for 11 years, nor did I ever intend to come to live in Europe. I had everything planned out in my junior year in high school, and everything was more or less going according to plan (engineering, phd program in EE, etc.) until the moment I decided to quit phd. Just saying

 

[rjakapeanut]

halfway through with college now, never wavered on my plans i made a year before freshmen year. my worst case scenario is (public interest) is still an enjoyable career imo, so i'm satisfied.

 

[jagmqt]

Originally Posted by Radagast

Question for the Lawyers on this forum.

I've had a chance to have a chat with two lawyers (one in his 50s, the other in her early 30s) I am acquainted with (i'm attempting to get a unpaid short stint at a law office to get a sense of what it is like) and they both said roughly the same thing to me... "I'd never want my children to become lawyers". Is this a common sentiment in the legal community? Would you encourage your kids to pursue a legal career?

I'm 32. My second career is law. I love it, and wish I wouldn't have wasted my time earlier. As for debt, I carry a pile of student loans...put them in the federal program and let the income contingent repayment plan make things easier.

(I'm a government attorney doing civil work, if you're curious.)

jag

 

[RSS]

My lawyers always tell me that a lawsuit is the last resort (good advice).

For this reason I think that becoming a lawyer is a last resort.

 

[aleksandr]

Originally Posted by Radagast

Question for the Lawyers on this forum.

I've had a chance to have a chat with two lawyers (one in his 50s, the other in her early 30s) I am acquainted with (i'm attempting to get a unpaid short stint at a law office to get a sense of what it is like) and they both said roughly the same thing to me... "I'd never want my children to become lawyers". Is this a common sentiment in the legal community? Would you encourage your kids to pursue a legal career?

If they have the temperament and the mentality (and the ability), why not? Its not that bad a life. I'm into my fourth year at biglaw (well, what passes for biglaw out here in the boonies - local office of a magic circle firm) and I'm reasonably satisfied with life. I pull on average 12 hour days, couple of hours here and there on the weekends, but generally life is better than most of my friends in IB. But then of course I've more or less known I've wanted to be a lawyer since I was fifteen or so, and I enjoy most parts of practice (except for document review and due diligence of course. yeech)

Sadly, way too many people are in law for the money, or the prestige, or whatever. Which of course brings it a bad name. But I do know quite a few people who are in law cause, well, they find law fun. The ones in it for the money will last as long as they find it worthwhile. Me? I'll practice til its time to start a family, then exit into some cushy in-house counsel job.

 

[Piobaire]

So, who'd have thought? I have a legit question to ask. If you get a JD on State A, can you gradaute then go write the bar in State B? Say it's a distance learning program, http://www.nwculaw.edu/cgi-bin/nwcu/index.html

 

[Usul]

I also have a legitimate question: I would like to ractice law but do not want to go to law school, distance or otherwise. What if I spent three years and a few tens of thousands of dollars falsifiying a law degree and then applied to sit the bar in my state? Sure, there is a change I may be caught and go to prison, but there is a not inconsiderable chance of that anyway in the practice of ordinary law.

What say you?

 

[romafan]

Originally Posted by Piobaire

So, who'd have thought? I have a legit question to ask. If you get a JD on State A, can you gradaute then go write the bar in State B? Say it's a distance learning program, http://www.nwculaw.edu/cgi-bin/nwcu/index.html

pio - yes, where you go to school has no bearing on where you sit for the bar (write the bar?

), although i believe some schools emphasize preparation for their state's test in their curriculum

in case you're not regularly updating yourself on the 'pashtuns are pedophiles' thread i wanted to be sure you saw this obit of d-day piper bill millin: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/20/wo...bituary&st=cse

 

[Piobaire]

Originally Posted by romafan

pio - yes, where you go to school has no bearing on where you sit for the bar (write the bar?

), although i believe some schools emphasize preparation for their state's test in their curriculum

in case you're not regularly updating yourself on the 'pashtuns are pedophiles' thread i wanted to be sure you saw this obit of d-day piper bill millin: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/20/wo...bituary&st=cse

Yes, I dropped out of that thread. Thanks for this link. Can anyone read that without getting a chill down their spine or watery eyed?

 

[crazyquik]

Originally Posted by Piobaire

So, who'd have thought? I have a legit question to ask. If you get a JD on State A, can you gradaute then go write the bar in State B? Say it's a distance learning program, http://www.nwculaw.edu/cgi-bin/nwcu/index.html

The answer, as usual, is it depends.

If you go to one of the ~200 ABA-accredited law schools, then you can sit for the bar in any other state.

If you go to an unaccredited law school . . . well good luck. Perhaps that particular state may let those people take their bar, but they will probably not be able to take most other bars.

But, as luck would have it, California doesn't require ABA-accreditation to sit for their bar. And, it just so happens, California is home to tons of diploma mills, err, unaccredited law schools, such as the one at your link. CA also has like a 39% bar passage rate (by far the lowest in the nation), but that's partially because 'anyone' can take their exam. In fact, you don't even have to go to law school; you can 'read law' in an apprenticeship under a licensed practioner for several years, and then take the CA bar. You can also read in maybe two other states.