Where would you prefer your clothes/shoes/accessories to be made, and why?

[lasbar]

Originally Posted by CashmereLover

I think "Made in France" is pretty rare, unfortunately. Don't see it very often. I love France so I'd also love to have something made by a Frenchman.


Cifonelli ,Camps de Luca,Charvet and many others.

Lobb Paris, Corthay, Delos,Dimitri Gomez and JM WESTON (their factory is in Limoges) for shoes.

A few years ,I would have put Hermes and Louis Vuitton but I'm not that sure anymore.

 

[onix]

Originally Posted by lasbar

A few years ,I would have put Hermes and Louis Vuitton but I'm not that sure anymore.

How so?

 

[TheWraith]

Originally Posted by CashmereLover

The title says it all... Where would you prefer your clothes/shoes/accessories to be made, and why?

I prefer England or Italy since those are traditional sartorial countries. They know how to make the real thing. Also, I'm confident in decent working conditions for labors. Finally, I can more easily relate culturally to European workers, as I'm from Europe myself.

Simply, "Made in Italy" means a lot to me - although I know e.g. fabric may just as well come from anywhere in the world.

Maybe this thread is a possible flamebait. If so, moderators, please do your thing...

I would prefer the two examples you list, Cashmere, but sometimes prices dictate otherwise, at last for me.

 

[luftvier]

Originally Posted by Lowndes

Are you thinking of TOMS? I bought a pair of their shoes for my sister in law for Christmas and they are actually pretty cheap. Definitely not $200. More like $50 or so.

$78-$125.

 

[binge]

I prefer my china made in China.

 

[Dan9019]

Originally Posted by luftvier

$78-$125.

$44-$85 ?

http://www.tomsshoes.com/productslist.aspx?CategoryID=8

 

[imatlas]

I wasn't aware that Lobb actually makes any shoes in Paris, I thought they were all made in Northampton. Do they have a factory in France, or do they contract out to JM Weston or somebody else?

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned Hungary, but I understand there's a little sweatshop in Budapest turning out crappy shoes for the American market.

 

[tsaltzma]

I'll buy stuff from just about anywhere if it is good quality and worth supporting, but I'm an American, so ofcourse I like to see a good product come from the USA. If not there, I prefer anywhere in the British Isles.

 

[holymadness]

Originally Posted by archetypal_yuppie

Thats cause their gov't pays them not to work, and charges them $$$ when they do work.
What?

They also think they're such hot **** with their wines/cheeses. Arg, the french

Well, this is true.

Originally Posted by HHD

There are a few. For example, Corthay, Charvet and Cifonelli at the high end, JM Weston, Paraboot and quite a lot of Agnès b in the middle range. There are plenty of producers of fine accessories.

There was an article on the subject of French-made clothing in le Figaro before Christmas. In an interview for the feature, Agnès b said that she's found increasing numbers of British and Japanese shoppers are demanding the Made in France stuff, which accounts for around 1/3 of her production and 2/3s of her revenues.

It is possible to produce in France, but it is true that employment laws and high payroll taxes do not make it easy. On a more anecdotal level, the practices of sewing on the label and designating the item "Made in XXXXX" and/or employing vast numbers of migrant workers in sweatshop conditions while giving the impression that your products are manufactured by traditional artisans are not so widespread in France.
I seem to remember hearing about that article but I never got a chance to read it. Do you have a link?

BTW here is a website/blog dedicated to cataloguing all French manufacturers of household goods, including clothing and shoes: http://lafabriquehexagonale.com/ (in French).

Originally Posted by CashmereLover

Of course there are examples, like the ones you mention, I just feel that it's much easier to find clothes/shoes/accessories made in e.g. Italy.

What would you consider to be the main reason for a slight lack of French made clothes - taxes & employment laws, or is it more of a cultural matter? For some reason I believe France is more about e.g. fragrance.
Several factors are involved. First is that there are not many large French fashion houses for men that are of a significant enough size to export their goods in quanitity. Examples of those that are include Hermès, Facconable, and Louis Vuitton. Of these, not all produce their goods in France. I've noticed that the majority of goods sold by Facconable are made in Italy, for example. So while there is a significant amount of domestic product being made, especially for the Parisian market, relatively little of it is seen outside of France.

Second, French goods are not particularly well-reputed on the international market, and even in France! To most Frenchmen, quality shoes come from England and quality suits come from Italy, just like for everyone else. Even among aficionados, I've observed very little awareness of things like canvassing or goodyear welting, i.e. the criteria that distinguish a high-quality product from a low-quality product. France has an immense and well-developed fashion culture, but a relatively unimpressive clothing culture. I hope it's clear what I mean when I say that.

Third, French goods are relatively expensive. Part of this is that the euro is so strong right now. Another part is that the principal domestic market (Paris) is used to paying ridiculous markup on all consumer goods, and so not only is French clothing expensive to buy here, but exporters are unwilling to singificantly drop the price for overseas sale. I'm sure another part of this equation is France's labour laws, but I don't know them in enough detail to comment.

Another contributing factor: the French brand, Hermès, has spent decades buying up dozens if not hundreds of small workshops in France and around the world. These ateliers produce excellent products but lack the size and ability to export and market them themselves, particularly on an international scale. Hermes takes care of that end of the business model, attaches its brand name to the finished product, and jacks up the price by 400%. For many, this is their only way to have access to these articles.

 

[BareSolid]

England/Scotland, but I wouldn't begrudge something made in Wales.

 

[columbia92]

China.... more specifically moderntailor.com because I am cheap and I love my clothe custom made. I know for a fact a lot of shirts that are made in Italy are really just "made in Italy by Chinese illegal immigrant" so I'm not sure why I would want to pay the premium to buy shirts/suits made in Italy.

 

[chrisb0109]

Originally Posted by luftvier

$78-$125.

Not true. They generally retail for right around $50. Some of the more "special" models are slightly higher.







They donate half of the shoes manufactured, which isn't really saying much. The cost for retailers to purchase them is ~$25. They are built like a Walmart shoe, likely costing in the range of $2 to produce.

So in effect, they are paying a third world worker minimum wage to make two $2 shoes, giving one to him, and selling the other one for $25. Its funny to see people get behind all of these "ethical" companies. It seems no one really understands the economics of it all.

 

[archetypal_yuppie]

Originally Posted by holymadness

What?


High VATs raise the costs of goods, and therefore reduce the market for those goods.
High income taxes reduce the income received per unit of work.

Both of these are disincentives to work and production.

High levels of social welfare provision reduce the incentive to work as well, since you will get medical care/welfare/food stamps/etc even if you sit at home doing nothing.

Therefore my comment "Charges you to do work and pays you not to work."

People respond to incentives...

 

[onix]

Originally Posted by archetypal_yuppie

High VATs raise the costs of goods, and therefore reduce the market for those goods.
High income taxes reduce the income received per unit of work.

Both of these are disincentives to work and production.

High levels of social welfare provision reduce the incentive to work as well, since you will get medical care/welfare/food stamps/etc even if you sit at home doing nothing.

Therefore my comment "Charges you to do work and pays you not to work."

People respond to incentives...

That's it. I am moving to France.

 

[OxxfordSJLINY]

Originally Posted by columbia92

China.... more specifically moderntailor.com because I am cheap and I love my clothe custom made. I know for a fact a lot of shirts that are made in Italy are really just "made in Italy by Chinese illegal immigrant" so I'm not sure why I would want to pay the premium to buy shirts/suits made in Italy.

For Italian brands, yes this is the case (but less than 50% of the time-about 25% or 40% of the time).

However, all custom tailors throughout Italy (regardless of what products they make) are 100% family maintained, operated, owned and run.

Everything in the second paragraph of this reply message is one of the biggest reasons as to why all of the custom tailors throughout Italy will comprise a majority or vast majority (75%, 90% or 99%) of whatever custom tailoring still exists in the world 40 years (actually, well beyond 40 years) from now (and why Italy will still have tons and tons and tons of custom tailors well beyond 40 years from now). Just like I said the other day in a reply message to a topic titled "Bespoke: The Beginning of the end".

My reply message to that topic titled "The Bespoke: The Beginning of the end" acknowledging regarding the future of a majority or vast majority (again, 75%, 90% or 99%) of custom tailoring being in Italy was posted on January 8th, 2010 at 6:27PM (Eastern Standard Time). This topic was posted by RSS on January 6th, 2010 at 7:30PM (Eastern Standard Time). Quite a few members of Style Forum gave hints and indications as well as implied that they agree with and support my statements 100% (something that rarely happens on SF).

You might want to check out this topic out and see for yourself, columbia92.

BTW, your claim about a lot of shirts that are made in Italy being made by illegal Chinese immigrants is 100% false (but only when it comes to custom tailors in Italy, again, regardless of what products they make).