**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.**

[patrickBOOTH]



I am wondering how this is possible since I thought this couldn't happen to a Goodyear welted shoe? I was under the impression that the uppers were stitched to the insole/welt instead of glued.

The shoes are made by Barker, model name is Grant.

With goodyear welted shoes the uppers are not stitched to the welt, they are generally stapled to the insole and gemming is glued to the insole and the welt is sewn into the gemming. It doesn't look like the gemming came loose on these, but rather the leather upper tore. Not sure what can be done. Perhaps send the pics to B Nelson to see what Nick says.

 

[David Copeland]

can anyone recommend a good match from another company, please?

Thanks so much in advance.

See the following:

http://www.styleforum.net/t/228153/...thread-tutorials-photos-etc/5685#post_6415612

 

[MoneyWellSpent]

With goodyear welted shoes the uppers are not stitched to the welt, they are generally stapled to the insole and gemming is glued to the insole and the welt is sewn into the gemming. It doesn't look like the gemming came loose on these, but rather the leather upper tore. Not sure what can be done. Perhaps send the pics to B Nelson to see what Nick says.

The uppers are definitely stitched to the welt. Staples are only initially used to hold the uppers securely to the gemming until the welt can be sewn on, which is what gives it the "permanent" binding. The gemming is glued to the insole while it is still a separate piece. After the insole (with attached gemming) is tacked to the bottom of the last, and the upper is stretched over the last, small nails are driven through the heel portion of the upper which clench the heel to the insole, thus securing the heel portion of the upper to the insole. For the sides, or middle waist area, staples are used to secure the upper to the gemming as a temporary hold. The forepart is lasted using a forepart lasting machine, which leaves a lip of the upper butted up against the gemming to be sewn together during welt attachment. After the upper is fully lasted, the welt is sewn on, with tread being driven through the welt, upper, and gemming at the same time. All three components are stitched together using the same thread. This is how 270 degree welted shoes are made.

For 360 degree welted shoes, the same process is done, except the small nails are not used to secure the heel portion to the insole. The heel is lasted in a similar way to the forepart, where a lip is left so that the heel portion of the upper is attached to the welt and gemming as well. The process for the forepart and sides is the same as it is for the 270 degree welted shoes described above.

That said, I wasn't sure what to make of his photos either.

 

[wurger]

MWS, thank you for the informative post of 360 welt vs 270 welt.

 

[patrickBOOTH]



The uppers are definitely stitched to the welt.  Staples are only initially used to hold the uppers securely to the gemming until the welt can be sewn on, which is what gives it the "permanent" binding.  The gemming is glued to the insole while it is still a separate piece.  After the insole (with attached gemming) is tacked to the bottom of the last, and the upper is stretched over the last, small nails are driven through the heel portion of the upper which clench the heel to the insole, thus securing the heel portion of the upper to the insole.  For the sides, or middle waist area, staples are used to secure the upper to the gemming as a temporary hold.  The forepart is lasted using a forepart lasting machine, which leaves a lip of the upper butted up against the gemming to be sewn together during welt attachment.  After the upper is fully lasted, the welt is sewn on, with tread being driven through the welt, upper, and gemming at the same time.  All three components are stitched together using the same thread.  This is how 270 degree welted shoes are made.  

For 360 degree welted shoes, the same process is done, except the small nails are not used to secure the heel portion to the insole.  The heel is lasted in a similar way to the forepart, where a lip is left so that the heel portion of the upper is attached to the welt and gemming as well.  The process for the forepart and sides is the same as it is for the 270 degree welted shoes described above.    

That said, I wasn't sure what to make of his photos either.  

I'm not so sure you are correct on the staples being temporary. I have had them pull out. The upper is definitely attached in a lot of shoes by those staples.

 

[benhour]

how barker shoes are made!!!


this look's like glue came out through the stitching holes!! if i remember corectly they use glue when they atach the outsole to secure it before the stitching!!
if you bought them new this is a good reason to send them back for replacement!!

 

[MoneyWellSpent]

I'm not so sure you are correct on the staples being temporary. I have had them pull out. The upper is definitely attached in a lot of shoes by those staples.

By temporary, I don't mean that they are pulled out and discarded. They are certainly left in place. They simply become unnecessary after the welt is stitched on. They use "cheaper" methods to hold shoes together until they are permanently stitched. Staples are used to hold the sides in place before being stitched, glue to hold the sole on before being stitched, glue to hold the heel on before being nailed, etc. etc. These "cheaper" methods theoretically act as a fail-safe in the event of failure of the "permanent" method, but technically they are temporary and are simply to aid in the construction process.

 

[MoneyWellSpent]

how barker shoes are made!!!


this look's like glue came out through the stitching holes!! if i remember corectly they use glue when they atach the outsole to secure it before the stitching!!
if you bought them new this is a good reason to send them back for replacement!!

I suppose that is possible. However, all shoes have their soles cemented on before stitching (Goodyear-welted, Blake/Rapid, Hand-welted, etc.), simply to keep everything intact while they are permanently bound. The glue isn't usually globbed on that thick, and I've never seen it ooze out like that. That would be a first for me if that is what happened.

 

[Noo Guy]

This is not worrisome, it is normal. Adding wax polish over the top of your cream will make the water bead up more effectively, if you so desire. Allen Edmonds does make wax polish: http://www.allenedmonds.com/aeonline/producti_SF652_1_40000000001_-1

Thank you very much for the advice regarding the water marks. I was concerned that the leather may be overly porous due to becoming dried out... I just wasn't sure.

As far as my gaffe regarding searching for AE carnauba polish... I will swear on a stack of whatever that I was on the website and on the right page, but they were missing at the moment... I feel a bit red-faced, but also grateful.

 

[glenjay]



The uppers are definitely stitched to the welt.  ...  

I appreciate your descriptions/explanations MWS, I am constantly learning from you.

how barker shoes are made!!!

...

Thanks for the link to the video benhour, it was fun, and informative, to watch.

 

[ZMEH]

Hey guys, any quick remedy for these "colour runs" on my Alden cape cods?

Thanks!

 

[BattlePope]

So, I'm going to pull the trigger on some shoe care products for my AE Park Avenue's in black. They are worn pretty infrequently (i.e. weddings, funerals, etc.) but would still like to care for them so they last a while. So far, my plan is to get:

http://www.amazon.com/Meltonian-Cre...UTF8&qid=1374615229&sr=8-1&keywords=Meltonian

http://www.amazon.com/Lexol-1013-Le...=1374615616&sr=8-2&keywords=lexol+conditioner

http://www.amazon.com/Kiwi-100%-Hor...F8&qid=1374615631&sr=1-1&keywords=shine+brush

Do I need anything else? My order of use would be:

1) Wipe shoes down with shirt.
2) Apply conditioner with shirt.
3) Let conditioner sit for a few hours.
4) Wipe off excess with dry shirt.
5) Apply Meltonian cream to shoe with shirt.
6) Wipe off excess with shirt.
7) Buff shoes with horsehair brush.

Does that process/methodology look okay? Is there anything else I should be doing? Once again, these are shoes that are worn very sparingly so I'm going to avoid a wax polish. Thoughts?

 

[benhour]

I suppose that is possible. However, all shoes have their soles cemented on before stitching (Goodyear-welted, Blake/Rapid, Hand-welted, etc.), simply to keep everything intact while they are permanently bound. The glue isn't usually globbed on that thick, and I've never seen it ooze out like that. That would be a first for me if that is what happened.

yes for me too but this is the only reasonable explanation i can think for that!!(if the shoes are new and not resoled)

Thanks for the link to the video benhour, it was fun, and informative, to watch.

you welcome Glengay! i think this is a good video to show how a goodyear -welted shoe is constracted!!

 

[glenjay]



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

So, I'm going to pull the trigger on some shoe care products for my AE Park Avenue's in black. They are worn pretty infrequently (i.e. weddings, funerals, etc.) but would still like to care for them so they last a while. So far, my plan is to get:

http://www.amazon.com/Meltonian-Cream-Leather-Polish-Colors/dp/B0019N8C4I/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374615229&sr=8-1&keywords=Meltonian

http://www.amazon.com/Lexol-1013-Leather-Conditioner-Liter/dp/B000637TNM/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1374615616&sr=8-2&keywords=lexol+conditioner

http://www.amazon.com/Kiwi-100%25-Horsehair-Shine-Brush/dp/B0010TR6NE/ref=sr_1_1?s=shoes&ie=UTF8&qid=1374615631&sr=1-1&keywords=shine+brush

Do I need anything else? My order of use would be:

1) Wipe shoes down with shirt.
2) Apply conditioner with shirt.
3) Let conditioner sit for a few hours.
4) Wipe off excess with dry shirt.
5) Apply Meltonian cream to shoe with shirt.
6) Wipe off excess with shirt.
7) Buff shoes with horsehair brush.

Does that process/methodology look okay? Is there anything else I should be doing? Once again, these are shoes that are worn very sparingly so I'm going to avoid a wax polish. Thoughts?

I would probably get two of the shoe brushes, because just wiping the shoes down with a shirt will not get the dust/dirt out of the seams and welt, where a shoe brush can, and you don't want your cleaning brush to also be your polishing brush.

Also, you will want the conditioner to soak in over night before adding the cream polish, in order for the shoe brush to buff the shoe cream properly.

 

[immaage]

Hi guys,

I'm hoping to get some advice/help. I recently purchased a pair of Alden Longwings and had them polished by a cobbler with Saphir prior to wearing them.

This evening, I decided to clean and polish them myself. I used Kirby Allison's Basic Shoe Care Guide (http://www.hangerproject.com/shoe-care-guide/basic-shoe-care-guide.html) and cleaned the shoe, applied a coat of renovateur, and then applied a coat of pommadier cream polish (neutral) - brushing in between coats.

After the coat of pommadier, I saw that certain parts of the shoe became darker than the normal color of the shoe (see attached pictures). I'm guessing it absorbed more of the cream than the other parts?

My question is - is this normal or am I doing something wrong (like applying too much cream)? Is it fixable?

Thanks!