List of Bare Necessities

[goodlife]

I think a silk-cotton or the warmer wearing silk-cashmere blend would ensure a nice hand and slight luster. If thickness or weight feels necessary even heavy linen wears pretty cool, and has textural interest. This combined with the shawl collar, which granted is a bit harder to find in cooler wearing textiles, equals a garment that holds its own. If this isn't formal enough fall back on the suit, for which it appears we have reached a consensus.

Another way to offset the informality of the sweater is to up the ante on another element of the ensemble. For example if you expect everyone else will be wearing shirt and blazer add a tie.

It is also important to remember that in all but the most rigid social circles, warmer weather tends to lead to less formality. As the OP indicated, this is not intended for a styleforum participant, but for someone who simple doesn't want to embarrass themselves

 

[unbelragazzo]

It's true that summer is less dressy, but navy SC (I'm using this terminology from now on to avoid confusion) occasions still exist. And I'm not really sold on the shawl cardigan as a replacement. Maybe for someone who kind of knows what they're doing and can identify and navigate fine differences in social situations and their dress code, but for the average guy, no. Precisely because it will be less common in the situations described.

Anyway I think the blazer stuff was clearer in the original post on my tumblr because it's a reblog of jesses post at PTO in which he approvingly raises the possibility of replacing metal buttons with something else:

http://ivorytowerstyle.tumblr.com/post/32882004396/good-post-from-jesse-at-pto-featuring-the-classic

 

[emptym]



I usually think of worsted wool when I think of suiting. I see a lot of people comment here that they avoid worsted wool sportcoats because they end up looking like ophaned suit jackets.
I've never owned anything in fresco, but it strikes me as a less formal fabric? It looks to have a coarser texture from the open weave.

I think this is all correct. But a worsted blazer is fine. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll take Manton's word.

People often take something they learned on SF and apply it in strange ways. Plato commented on this with the analogy of puppies getting their teeth. Just as puppies get new teeth and start to use them everywhere with destructive consequences, so people (usually the youth) learn new information try to apply it everywhere inappropriately. Don't take that personally. I know I've done the same thing and probably still do. But I think it's a good reminder that reality is complicated, so we should be cautious.

I think the word "blazer" has now morphed into meaning a wider class of jackets. It had a historical meaning that's different, but now few enough people are aware of that definition and it is used to refer to enough other things, that the meaning has changed...
I think I may swap out for some MoP next spring/summer

I think you're right. But if SF is not about calling people to a higher or at least an anachronistic standard, then what else is it about?

I had three blazers (strictly defined) until a year or two ago. One I'd had for 20 yrs. Found myself wearing them less and less, partly due to the move out west. Now I have one (w/ silver-tone buttons, kept in my office for emergencies as another mentioned). One I gave away when I got a fresco blazersuit w/ horn buttons, and one, in flannel, I switched to dark mop. Very happy w/ the change.

... a shawl collar cardigan...

Good idea. I wear a shawl collar cardigan or full zip sweater on days when I'm not teaching.

I'm so heavily biased towards shawl collared cardigans I can't even comment.

Did you mean biased against them?

 

[Claghorn]

Did you mean biased against them?

No, towards them. I love them. Hence the cognitive dissonance (I really wanted them to be included in the list as a substitute for a blazer, but I didn't really believe they were).

I think half my posts on WAYWRN so far involve shawl collars.

I think you're right. But if SF is not about calling people to a higher or at least an anachronistic standard, then what else is it about?

 

[jrd617]



I think this is all correct. But a worsted blazer is fine. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll take Manton's word.
People often take something they learned on SF and apply it in strange ways. Plato commented on this with the analogy of puppies getting their teeth. Just as puppies get new teeth and start to use them everywhere with destructive consequences, so people (usually the youth) learn new information try to apply it everywhere inappropriately. Don't take that personally. I know I've done the same thing and probably still do. But I think it's a good reminder that reality is complicated, so we should be cautious.

Definitely a pup compared to the old (big?) timer posters.

BTW, Googled "navy blazer" and came up with this image showing Sean Connery what some SF commenters say is a sin: a navy jacket with charcoal pants ("not enough contrast")

Learn something new every day here

 

[goodlife]

I would think if one couldn't 'dress up' a cardigan enough then the occasion would be formal enough for a suit dressed down with an OCBD. If this is to be a basic wardrobe for a man uninterested in the subtleties of personal style, than keep it simple...when in doubt, suit up.

I don't expect, not was I trying to convince you to change your list, but I do think its worth the discussion.

 

[mcbrown]



BTW, Googled "navy blazer" and came up with this image showing Sean Connery what some SF commenters say is a sin: a navy jacket with charcoal pants ("not enough contrast")

Learn something new every day here

Exactly. The navy blazer, shiny buttons and all, works with so many combinations that I truly cannot conceive of a more useful odd jacket, especially if you are only going to own one and only one odd jacket.

As for the idea that it somehow doesn't fit in the "real world" anymore, I think this gets it backwards. Most men who don't regularly wear odd jackets (a) don't know what "odd jacket" means, (b) think "blazer" and "sports coat" are synonymous, and (c) by default think that either term refers to a blue jacket, with shiny buttons.

 

[suitntieguy]

my comments on the navy blazer (yes gold buttons)

I work in the investment world and have long been in the camp that the dress code bar has been continuously lowered over the years and as such always opted to fully suit up every day to the office. Keep in mind I always had choice between biz casual and full suit and tie as my office supports both. I, however, like most on here, would rather be the best dressed in the room. I have now been in too many meetings (100s) with various highly regarded professionals to have seen the blazer without a tie, while certainly under-dressed if comparing to a suit, exude a sense of confidence. Put differently, the high quality blazer and pant look can often say, I made it and I do not need to wear a suit and tie any longer as my daily work uniform. Has anyone else experienced this as well?

 

[Trompe le Monde]



I think this is all correct. But a worsted blazer is fine. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll take Manton's word.
People often take something they learned on SF and apply it in strange ways.

at some point people need to form their own judgement and opinions, and not blindly follow that of some guy -- be it manton or morel

i am not at all saying take 1 morsel of truth and run with it, either. what im saying is i would never allude to another 'authority' figure as confirmation of my own viewpoints

 

[emptym]



No, towards them. I love them. Hence the cognitive dissonance (I really wanted them to be included in the list as a substitute for a blazer, but I didn't really believe they were).

Ah, thanks.

at some point people need to form their own judgement and opinions, and not blindly follow that of some guy -- be it manton or morel
i am not at all saying take 1 morsel of truth and run with it, either. what im saying is i would never allude to another 'authority' figure as confirmation of my own viewpoints

You're certainly right that at some point, people need to do what they think/feel is right. However, I'm not sure how that applies here, since (1) I don't see any indication that anyone was following anyone else "blindly," and, (2) in this particular conversation, the person I was writing to had already acknowledged Manton as an authority.

Also, while "blindly" following someone may not be the wisest course, it's just as foolish to go to the other extreme and never refer to authority figures, since: (a) In objective matters, there certainly are authorities. And those who are less authoritative are wise to seek confirmation from them. Of course, no one is perfect. And it is good keep this in mind. (b) One person's free, open-eyed, authentic decision can be to trust and follow another.

Taste in clothing combines objective and subjective elements. The question of whether or not a type of fabric for a type of garment has been commonly acceptable in a given culture is objective. And on such questions, one is wise to refer to authorities.

 

[hendrix]

agreed, even if you decide the advice doesn't apply to you, it's still useful as long as you know where it's coming from and why it's suggested.

Do you think that a navy worsted might be a little too formal a jacket to have as the one odd jacket? it seems like it demands a tie.

 

[unbelragazzo]

At the Stewart/O'Reilly debate right now. Definitely a great occasion for a navy SC.

 

[goodlife]

Post withdrawn.

 

[unbelragazzo]

I dont see anything offensive or off-topic. Sometimes the best reaction is just to ignore.

 

[unbelragazzo]

Probably more odd jackets than suits at the opera for the matinee today. Suit not at all out of place though. A few guys here and there withou jackets, looking like 14 year olds