Hermes bow ties question

[christianch]

I have recently purchased some Hermes bow ties (to self-tie) and I am completely in love with the size, style (too many bow ties are way too big. These are not) and the material.

Since I am very new to bow ties I think that the style for an hermes bow tie is butterfly am I right ? (it looks like this one
http://www.ebay.com/itm/STYLISH-EQU...071721324?pt=US_Mens_Ties&hash=item51bd81576c )

Since I am very new with bow ties can you kindly elaborate on similar styles or high end manufacturers that provide traditional bow ties (no hook) ?

These seems to have a different shape
http://www.drakes-london.com/online-shop/bow-ties?shape_filter=268
as the description says " if required, be taken off without undoing the bow." I assume that these are not traditional ones like these of Hermes.

Thanks in advance for your guidance !
Christian

 

[dopey]

Some manufacturers have a hook that allows a tied to be removed without untying it. Charvet does that.
The Hermes in the eBay link is a standard butterfly. The drakes are pointed end batwings. While batwings are as standard as butterflies, the pointed end is less so (and can also be on a butterfly shape). But pointed ends are just less common but not especially rare. These things are matters of preference and not terribly significant. My preference is for a slightly shaped pointed end batwing, but I care much more about the overall size and pattern than the shape.

 

[christianch]

Thanks for your reply. Which other manufacturers will do some without hook ? Thanks
Christian

 

[Pochette]

Cordial Churchman will make them any size and shape you like. Rock Avenue Bowties also has some great ones, although the size and shape is set on those. Most of the high end necktie makers do not offer large selections for bow ties at the present.

 

[dopey]

Most. The hook that allows it to come apart is not that common. Charvet was the only one I knew of offhand.
Jpress was a good source but I now mostly buy from a local shop.
Btw, the hook shouldn't bother you. If well constructed, you won't notice it one way or the other. I can't comment on drakes as I haven't any, but the charvet hook doesn't make a difference to how I knot the tie.

 

[christianch]

Many thanks for the advice. Charvet is not available where I live and all the ones available through Mr Porter are already tied.
http://www.turnbullandasser.co.uk has some that seem without hook so I will keep looking of what would be available in the size and style I like
Thanks

 

[dopey]

Try also Sam Hober. They will make to your specs, though that is more work on your end than you may think.

 

[Vintage Gent]



Try also Sam Hober. They will make to your specs, though that is more work on your end than you may think.

A second vote for Sam Hober. David (the proprietor of Sam Hober) is a genuine pleasure to work with.

 

[Atgemis]

Re: Hermes Bow Tie


The bow tie you show there is what we refer to as a mid butterfly bow tie. It is not as wide as a standard butterfly bow tie and the curve is less pronounced. By the looks of it the bow tie is made using printed silk twill as is the case with most Hermes ties.

The main shapes for a bow tie are as follows:

1. Batwing - made famous by Charvet, straight edge either side.
2. Diamond Point - as you can imagine, there is a diamond point at either side. This can either be in the shape of a batwing or a butterfly bow, but the difference being you will see a pointed tip on either side.
3. Skinny batwing: Think of Sean Connery as James Bond with a skinny bow tie. This is a batwing cut to around 4cm.
4. Modified Butterfly: This is where there is a curved underside and a straight edge on top. This is not as common as a the other shapes.
5. Classic Butterfly: a bow tie with which is scooped both top and bottom and roughly 7.5cm at it's widest point.
6. Oversized Butterfly: Reaching between 9 and 11cm in total height this bow tie is for bigger gentleman or that 70's kind of spread.
7. Mid Butterfly: Noted in your post.A more gentle scoop and fluid shape.
8. Mid Batwing: very unusual, this bow tie sits between the 4cm slim and 7.5cm normal size. The only example of this I have seen is a Japanese company called Hanae Mori.


Of course, you can create any bow tie pattern you want, but these are the main types I know of.

If you would like more information you can see our blog www.lenoeudpapillon.blogspot.com

I attach a classic Yves Saint Laurent bow tie in a black satin basket weave with no lining which we were asked to reconstruct this week. I think you will agree that it is more of a classic butterfly than yours.

 

[christianch]

Thanks for the suggestion re: Sam Hober.

• Atgemis; Thank you for the very informative post. I did buy two of your bow ties through the hanger project. They should reach me soon ! I did read some of your blogs review about your visit to Paris etc. Would you be able to do custom mid-butterfly bow ties like the Hermes one ? PM me if is possible.

 

[Atgemis]

Yes we can make the same shape. We have one on file almost exactly the same but you see every silk reacts to a bow tie differently. A silk twill will tie differently between the weights, a woven jacquard another way, a rich mogador satin silk another. Please go to www.lenoeudpapillon.com and shoot me an email on the contact page. Best, Nicholas

 

[Atgemis]



Most. The hook that allows it to come apart is not that common. Charvet was the only one I knew of offhand.
Jpress was a good source but I now mostly buy from a local shop.
Btw, the hook shouldn't bother you. If well constructed, you won't notice it one way or the other. I can't comment on drakes as I haven't any, but the charvet hook doesn't make a difference to how I knot the tie.

Thats not true on the Charvet bow ties. They are excellent quality and well made but the clasp unbuckles all the time. I have 8 bows from Charvet and that is the one let down on otherwise great batwing bow ties.

 

[Atgemis]

There is a way to see all those shapes. If you type in ' bow tie shapes family le noeud papillon ' we have some good image references for you

 

[christianch]

I did see that image thank you. None of the shapes were like the Hermes but you did clarify that it is mid butterfly. I saw your nice report on your visit to Charvet. So all their bow ties have hooks ? The only charvet I have is already tied + hook.

 

[Atgemis]

This is an example of a modified butterfly shape. There is a soft drape on the underside which differentiates it from both a batwing and a butterfly. The batwing is even top and bottom - eg charvet whereas the butterfly flares top and bottom eg turnbull and asser