The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

[Timmers]

What MTM maker will you be using for this?

Personally, I'd stick with classic styling details:
wide peak
grosgrain faced lapels
1 button, grosgrain covered
jetted pockets
dual vents (where I opt to break the traditional rules)

InStitchu, done most of my MTM with them.

I was going to go dual vents as well. Just feels more comfortable and I don't really think it compromises the look much (or at all, really). I prefer the look of grosgrain as well. I managed to pick up a really nice bowtie from Le Noeud Papillon recently, but it's not grosgrain.

 

[The Chai]

Me personally I would go for a db 1b shawl. I find it easier to wear in this day and age due to its relaxed nature. It's the one I almost always go for when in doubt

 

[SJTM]

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

 

[Timmers]

Me personally I would go for a db 1b shawl.

I'd love this, actually. Just not sure if I will for my first tbh. Do you have a pic of yours?

 

[classicalthunde]

InStitchu, done most of my MTM with them.

I was going to go dual vents as well. Just feels more comfortable and I don't really think it compromises the look much (or at all, really). I prefer the look of grosgrain as well. I managed to pick up a really nice bowtie from Le Noeud Papillon recently, but it's not grosgrain.

My tuxedo was from Kent Wang and one of my first MTM purchases. One of the things I wished I had paid a bit more attention to in my early MTM orders is the fabric. I chose a basic, light VBC twill and in retrospect I wish I had chosen a tad heavier barathea with a wool-mohair mix.

Not sure what merchants/mills InSitchu orders from, but it might be worth popping by the Unfunded Liabilities thread to see what they recommend. If I could do it all again I would get a Smith Woollens 10 oz barathea in a 70/30 wool-mohair mix

 

[Faux Brummell]

Big thumbs up to waistcoat with lapels!

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

 

[classicalthunde]

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

Personally, I would take whatever I would spend on Camina whole cuts and add it to upgrading my tuxedo rig and going a rung higher than Black Label or Oliver Wicks

I barely wear my black cap toes as it is, so black whole cuts would just sit in the closet for ~360 days a year. Plus, I feel footwear is one of the places where you can push the boundaries of traditional rules within reason

 

[Timmers]

Not sure what merchants/mills InSitchu orders from, but it might be worth popping by the Unfunded Liabilities thread to see what they recommend. If I could do it all again I would get a Smith Woollens 10 oz barathea in a 70/30 wool-mohair mix

They have a starting range that includes some stuff from Filarte and elsewhere. They also have VBC, REDA, Zegna, Stylbiella, and some others I believe, off the top of my head.

 

[The Chai]

I'd love this, actually. Just not sure if I will for my first tbh. Do you have a pic of yours?

Here's a picture of one of the gold standards for me instead!

 

[sftiger]

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

I believe SS is better made than those other options. You absolutely cannot go wrong with the classic SS peak lapel tux. It's a great mix of classic without looking too dated.

I don't get the hate for patent leather, but to each their own. I'd avoid captoes like the AE PAs - they will look odd, and will bring down the look IMO. Wholecuts would look better. Even better are these BB patent leather shoes - plus, they're on 50% off sale (plus 3% cashback from ebates!) which is the cheapest I've seen them and a pretty good deal.

Cummerbund vs waistcoat - up to you. 95% of people will probably be in cummerbunds (or nothing...) but both looks are nice. And yes, the fabric should match.

 

[Nobilis Animus]

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

I cannot speak to the two brands you mentioned, but a lot of people seem happy with SuitSupply. They seem to have things on the slimmer side, however, so bear that in mind. If you want to try the others, getting a suit done first is a good idea.

As for the rest: A lot will depend on how formally you want to approach Black Tie. Some like to keep to strict rules, or else don't wear it often and want to make its occasional use more special by doing things perfectly, and others wear it often enough that they don't find it very formal at all.

I'm a fan of either waistcoats or nothing. With a waistcoat, lapels or not is up to your preference - that's one example of a styling detail that should reflect your personality, not someone else's. The fabric, however, should be a close match to the jacket.

As far as shoes, black oxfords - either captoe or wholecut - will work fine. They're proper for both Black and White Tie, although other options include opera pumps (on the more formal side). I personally prefer captoes when I want to be more formal, and black loafers when I do not. I've no time for a whole cut of anything.

 

[Nobilis Animus]

An old thread I ran across again today on the subject of 'Black Tie Casual.'

"Black Tie Casual"

Having posted enough garbage in the last half hour to make this my 2,000th post, let me now explain the title and purpose of this thread. While "business casual" is much maligned, many well-dressed men are able to navigate the casualization of business attire without completely losing touch with...

www.styleforum.net

A few interesting ideas, and a few blunders, for anyone who cares to look.

 

[SJTM]

I believe SS is better made than those other options. You absolutely cannot go wrong with the classic SS peak lapel tux. It's a great mix of classic without looking too dated.

I don't get the hate for patent leather, but to each their own. I'd avoid captoes like the AE PAs - they will look odd, and will bring down the look IMO. Wholecuts would look better. Even better are these BB patent leather shoes - plus, they're on 50% off sale (plus 3% cashback from ebates!) which is the cheapest I've seen them and a pretty good deal.

Cummerbund vs waistcoat - up to you. 95% of people will probably be in cummerbunds (or nothing...) but both looks are nice. And yes, the fabric should match.

Thanks for the input. Spoke to Suit Supply and it seems they may be an excellent choice. Plan to visit their Boston store in the coming days. They suggested I try on some suits as their cut is very different than my standard go to (BB 1818 Regent Fit).

I also purchased a pair of the BB patent shoes online (had a linen jacket in the shopping cart in any event). Will see how they look / feel in person and then decide. No details on construction so I assume it is blake stitched. Thanks for the heads up on these.

 

[sftiger]

I also purchased a pair of the BB patent shoes online (had a linen jacket in the shopping cart in any event). Will see how they look / feel in person and then decide. No details on construction so I assume it is blake stitched. Thanks for the heads up on these.

I imagine so. But for $199, it’s very classic looking shoe you will almost certainly wear no more than 4-5 times a year max, so unlikely to fall apart anytime soon. My parent leather shoes have are ~11 years old and have gotten fault heavy wear and still look great.

 

[ericgereghty]

Decided to return the HF tuxedo I purchased recently and look into MTM. I also have a SuitSupply retail store near me and plan to stop in to see what they can offer. Unfortunately, I only have about a 5" drop, so their OTR will need alterations.

My research seems to indicate two good options for MTM: Oliver Wicks and Black Lapel. Both seem to have good reputations for both quality and customer service ( an important criteria as most people say getting your first suit to fit correctly will require some back and forth). I do not have experience with either, but plan to try one for a suit first and then follow up with a tuxedo.

A question for the group: Should I go with a cummerbund or a waistcoat? If a waistcoat, with or without lapels? BL offers a shawl collar lapel on their waistcoat as an option with their peak lapel, single button tuxedo. Also, should fabric of waistcoat match fabric of tuxedo?

Finally, what are preferred shoe option? In the past I have worn a highly polished pair of AE PA's. Not a fan of patent leather, unless oxford lace ups ( not the derbys everyone seems to make). Wondering if I should buy a pair of Carmina black calf wholecuts or something similar.

IRT the drop of an SS tux, aren't their suits usually a drop 6? I would think the pants, provided they fit your frame well, could easily be adjusted at the waist to accommodate.