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SeaDweller

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FWIW, it took a *LOT* of work to get my AE Park Aves built up. Some folks from the 2017 AE appreciation thread will recall my frustrations, which I may have vented once or thrice in the process. :hide:

As others have mentioned, keep at it and allow lots of time for the layers to dry. Also look into getting some Saphir Mirror Gloss, as the Pate de Luxe--while excellent--has a lot more solvents and takes longer to fully dry at least with what I've used it for to date. The Mirror Gloss seems to dry more quickly and thicker build up is more easily accomplished.

We "cheated" back when we still wore black combat boots we had to polish, and used a hair dryer or (the more adventurous of us) cigarette lighter to help melt the wax and get it built into the pores a little more quickly. I may have eventually engaged in similar behavior with my Park Aves. I regret nothing. ;)

I’ve found letting the layers/process dry for a couple of days and to repeat it again as needed to be really helpful.
 

freshstyle

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Kirby Allison has a great video on suede care. I’d say wear in the rain if you’ve treated it with repellent.

yeah, i saw kirby's video. but that is the first time i heard about conditioning suede.

and also, the way he was shampooing the shoes basically means it is ok to get them wet because they were practically soaked in water.
 

purpleporing

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8458254A-2ABA-44C2-806A-A3A637FC060D.jpeg BD4C7351-F8AA-4528-9263-623CCF295910.jpeg Hey all. Does this look like normal wear on soles? (Some of it looks/feels sort of like cracking.). New maker I’m not familiar with so I’m not entirely sure if it might just be normal wear and tear on some shoes.
 

Nick V.

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View attachment 968273 View attachment 968274 Hey all. Does this look like normal wear on soles? (Some of it looks/feels sort of like cracking.). New maker I’m not familiar with so I’m not entirely sure if it might just be normal wear and tear on some shoes.

It's not normal but it does happen with inferior and/or dried out leather. Sometimes a maker will stain their leather soles black in order to hide the imperfections in the leather. In this case it looks like the leather was to dry. If you are not happy with the amount of wear you've gotten out of your shoes (soles) you certainly have grounds to bring it up with the outfit where you purchased them.
 

purpleporing

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It's not normal but it does happen with inferior and/or dried out leather. Sometimes a maker will stain their leather soles black in order to hide the imperfections in the leather. In this case it looks like the leather was to dry. If you are not happy with the amount of wear you've gotten out of your shoes (soles) you certainly have grounds to bring it up with the outfit where you purchased them.

Hmm, very interesting. Thanks. These were a recent eBay purchase, but the maker is—or at least is supposed to be—Yohei Fukuda (and judging from the rest of the shoes, shoe trees, shoe bags, etc., it doesn’t appear to be a fake... and if it is, someone went to great lengths to fake a Japanese brand generally unknown to normal non-shoe people and then sell a used pair?! Doubtful). I wouldn’t have expected a $2400 (retail) handwelted shoe to have anything that’s inferior, but I don’t know. Or maybe the previous owner did something stupid?
 
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Nick V.

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Hmm, very interesting. Thanks. These were a recent eBay purchase, but the maker is—or at least is supposed to be—Yohei Fukuda (and judging from the rest of the shoes, shoe trees, shoe bags, etc., it doesn’t appear to be a fake... and if it is, someone went to great lengths to fake a Japanese brand generally unknown to normal non-shoe people and then sell a used pair?! Doubtful). I wouldn’t have expected a $2400 (retail) handwelted shoe to have anything that’s inferior, but I don’t know. Or maybe the previous owner did something stupid?

There is no way I can address the history or origin of your shoe. How would I know? However, I can share my experience and knowledge with you. Don't go by the price tag of a shoe and assume it's worth the price they are selling for. I've seen bespoke shoes that sell for north of $2500.00. To me between workmanship and materials used I wouldn't pay $200.00 for them. A pair came in today with a very prestigious brand (Asian). The shoe was built well but the materials used were for s#@t! There is a very prestigious shoe brand which is known for the color the sole is painted. That became a status symbol. Truth is the reason the sole was/is painted is to hide the flaws in the leather. The color of the sole has now become a major selling point.
You can't judge a book..............
 

SeaDweller

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There is a very prestigious shoe brand which is known for the color the sole is painted. That became a status symbol. Truth is the reason the sole was/is painted is to hide the flaws in the leather. The color of the sole has now become a major selling point.
You can't judge a book..............

CLB?
 

FredAstaire1899

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My suede shoes have unfortunately been damaged, I guess by rubbing against something overtime.

View attachment 928613

Is there any action I can take to:

1) Prevent any further peeling of the (split?) suede in the damaged area?
2) Patch them?
3) Make them more sightly?

What is that in the hole? In the photo it looks like fabric. It does not look like another layer of leather--perhaps some sort of backing or wide topline tape? If that's the case, it can be cobbled back into some sort of normal appearance (depending on your definition of "normal") but it will never be "right.'

Manufacturers, more often than not, use splits as suede. This is the layer below the grain surface and the weakest. It is subject to "disintegration" (the only word I can come up with) because the fiber mat is so loose and incoherent. And it is often thinner in places than the surrounding leather. It needs to be "backed" to give it the strength that it doesn't naturally have. I would be reluctant even to last a split, esp. in a shoe appropriate thickness, without backing it.

I followed this up with a few repairers (including a maker), and they all said they couldn't do anything with it. They didn't want to patch over it. The cloth looking backing is breaking apart now and starting to become unstable. Does anybody have any tricks to help stop further damage and make them a bit more sightly? Thanks.
 

DWFII

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Hmm, very interesting. Thanks. These were a recent eBay purchase, but the maker is—or at least is supposed to be—Yohei Fukuda (and judging from the rest of the shoes, shoe trees, shoe bags, etc., it doesn’t appear to be a fake... and if it is, someone went to great lengths to fake a Japanese brand generally unknown to normal non-shoe people and then sell a used pair?! Doubtful). I wouldn’t have expected a $2400 (retail) handwelted shoe to have anything that’s inferior, but I don’t know. Or maybe the previous owner did something stupid?

First, since this was an Ebay purchase you don't know where it's been or what has been done to it. The previous owner could have fallen asleep with his feet on a hassock in front of a fire. The outsoles definitely look like they were dried out/burnt/damaged. The question is did it happen at the tannery? At the maker? Or afterwards? That black paint could easily have been applied after the damage was done either at the advice of a cobbler or at the request of a customer.

Second, leather is not plastic, even though many people would wish it were, even to the point of adamantly treating it, and expecting it to perform, like it was plastic. It came from a living animal and was/is subject to all the vicissitudes of life--diet, injury, genetics. Sometimes it is scarred. Sometimes it is delayed in the tanning process and damaged slightly.

I have seen and handled many, many skins/hides--chrome tanned, veg tanned, veg retan, upper leather, outsole leather, insole leather, etc.. I have never seen a perfect hide. Even prime skins may have slight imperfections. It doesn't make them less than prime. This has been the case, and the norm, time-out-of-mind. All ornamentation...all...from dye jobs to broguing, fudging, crowing, wheeling, jiggering, to multi-piece shoes, almost certainly have their origins in the fact that leather is not perfect.

And then you have the footprints of the maker--inadvertent or unavoidable tool marks left behind. Such techniques were, and are, implemented to draw the eye away from flaws. No harm, no foul.

Dyeing the outsole isn't necessarily an attempt to cover-up poor quality--as can be seen quite clearly here, dyeing or painting the outsole, whether at make-up or after the fact, cannot "cure" the problem. If the damage/problem is in any way more than "skin deep", it always reveals itself sooner or later.
 
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troika

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Gents, I love the explanations and the discussion, but is there anything he can do at this point? I would like to know as well, I have a pair of butteros which have cracking in the sole leather between the rubber pad and the heel (I didn't properly condition it while wearing them in the winter slush :()

Would conditioning the sole help @purpleporing in any way? Would a resole be the answer?
 

purpleporing

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Nick V and DWFII,

I greatly appreciate you sharing your knowledge and experience. It appears settled that this does not fall under "normal wear and tear" of a pair of shoes, regardless of where in the shoes' life something caused this damage. I am now trying to contact some people who might have connections to the maker to see if I can get a resoling done. In the meantime--and especially if my attempts to get this resoled fails--do either of you (or anybody else) have any suggestions for at least hopefully keeping the damage from getting any worse?

I suppose I could also try for an eBay return based on undisclosed damage and what not, but I really do like these shoes and it's practically impossible to get it in the US.
 

DWFII

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Well, conditioning the outsole won't close up or "heal" the cracks...anymore than painting over them did.

Resoling would replace the outsole, so...the old sole with the cracks in it would no longer be there would it? Theoretically, shoes...esp. good shoes...are designed and made to be resoled.
 

DWFII

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Nick V and DWFII, any suggestions for at least hopefully keeping the damage from getting any worse?

Well, one of the reasons I made the comment was that I have a hard time believing that a maker of the caliber in question would deliberately use poor quality outsoling. What's more, I regret that the association was made in the first place. Anytime you buy a pair of shoes off Ebay the whole equation changes.

As for the question...of course it's going to get worse. The cracks cannot be healed. Whatever caused the cracking originally, cannot be undone and in all likelihood is still affecting the shoe in one way or the other. If the leather is dried out enough to crack, conditioning is not going to be significantly effective. Think of it like a crack in metal, flexing only makes it worse.
 


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