The Official Dieworkwear Appreciation Thread

[mhip]

I block everyone on twitter, by not joining.

too many skankhunt42s

 

[maxalex]

I like how he continues to call out GJ Cleverly for being sh1t with specific examples from SF.

On the outer worker thing, I still don’t understand why the historical WE firms charge just as much as the French firms but the French firms use all in house employees paying them a livable wage. It’s not like Paris rent is that much cheaper than London rent.

France has much stronger workers rights than the UK, where it seems to me a lot of that went away under Thatcher and never came back; it’s much more like the Darwinian US system than here on the Continent. That said, I’m no expert on UK labor law, especially since their brilliant Brexit decision. But I used to manage a newspaper with a Paris bureau and I remember we could never fire anybody there short of actual criminal conviction, preferably for murder.

 

[beargonefishing]

If you're referring to this "Since then, I’ve noticed other problems from major West End firms. The scales on these alligator loafers don’t match across the left and right shoes"
take a look at the scales on the left and right shoes. They don't have to match exactly but these are mismatched. The larger scales shows this much better than smaller scales.

Evident on these 2 rows of scales.
View attachment 1906949

2 gators, 1 pair.

 

[JohnMRobie]

I like how he continues to call out GJ Cleverly for being sh1t with specific examples from SF.

On the outer worker thing, I still don’t understand why the historical WE firms charge just as much as the French firms but the French firms use all in house employees paying them a livable wage. It’s not like Paris rent is that much cheaper than London rent.

I forget which maker it was but one of the French makers (I think Berluti?) did an interview and discussed why this is. If I recall correctly, in addition to the strong employee protections, France has a pretty strong apprenticeship program. The maker viewed that as somewhat of a double edged sword in that they hire French workers mostly because of it and need to turn down foreign workers who in some cases are more enthusiastic about learning the trade and they need more shoemakers.

 

[brill]

If you're referring to this "Since then, I’ve noticed other problems from major West End firms. The scales on these alligator loafers don’t match across the left and right shoes"
take a look at the scales on the left and right shoes. They don't have to match exactly but these are mismatched. The larger scales shows this much better than smaller scales.

Evident on these 2 rows of scales.
View attachment 1906949

Yes this is what I was reffering to. Is that an extreme ask for the shoemaker to match the scales? Or is a general uniformity more than acceptable, id imagine the cost to get a perfect match would be borderline inhumane.

Otherwise all the other gripes in the article made sense to me.

 

[JohnMRobie]

Yes this is what I was reffering to. Is that an extreme ask for the shoemaker to match the scales? Or is a general uniformity more than acceptable, id imagine the cost to get a perfect match would be borderline inhumane.

Otherwise all the other gripes in the article made sense to me.

If you think that would be inhumane just wait until you hear about the cost at GC to get a mismatched pair…

But no - it is not an unreasonable ask to have the scales be roughly the same scale.

 

[willy cheesesteak]

I never use Twitter, but every digest I get now wants me to read Derek.

I think that Derek's use of the block button points to the profound failure of Twitter as a community. In any real community, there are always people that you just don't like, but because of the norms of the community, you can at least co-exist. You might avoid them, but you don't simply exclude people from your circle. There is no expectation that everyone agree. There is an expectation that people exhibit some level of civility that is mostly self-policed.

Twitter does not have these societal norms and expectations that are critical to a functional society.

that tweet was a semi-joke tweet that came after another funny block everyone tweet that he retweeted from someone else. how some people in this thread read that so seriously, i don't even know lol.

twitter is prob the most entertaining platform imo. i don't know how you guys are using it but when i go on, i get breaking news while it happens, funny tweets, learn about cool stuff i never knew of, and the latest memes.

 

[LA Guy]

that tweet was a semi-joke tweet that came after another funny block everyone tweet that he retweeted from someone else. how some people in this thread read that so seriously, i don't even know lol.

twitter is prob the most entertaining platform imo. i don't know how you guys are using it but when i go on, i get breaking news while it happens, funny tweets, learn about cool stuff i never knew of, and the latest memes.

I've always hated it. And now I have even more reason to. It's not an uncommon sentiment, and there are plenty of others, not just here, who have voiced similar concerns about the platform. I've gone in detail why I think that the platform sucks. Honestly, I prefer Facebook, and I really don't like Facebook.

Evidently, you like twitter. That's fine, but there are also legitimate explanations re. why that platform brings out the worst in a lot of people, and also legitimate dangers associated with the platform. No platform is perfect, sure, but some are more inherently problematic. There is a whole literature about the social dynamics of different places in the internet ecosystem.

I don't think that there is that much more ground to cover.

 

[bernoulli]

France has much stronger workers rights than the UK, where it seems to me a lot of that went away under Thatcher and never came back; it’s much more like the Darwinian US system than here on the Continent. That said, I’m no expert on UK labor law, especially since their brilliant Brexit decision. But I used to manage a newspaper with a Paris bureau and I remember we could never fire anybody there short of actual criminal conviction, preferably for murder.

Here is an explanation from a macroeconomics textbook:
An employer must be able to justify the termination with a real and serious cause (“cause réelle et sérieuse”). Judges can reverse individual and collective firings if the court does not find the economic arguments strong enough. The minimum wage is almost €18,000 (or USD 22,000 as of February 2018 rates). Labor reform in 2017 tried to make labor markets a bit more flexible but didn't advance things much.

Unemployment is structurally lower in the US. Easier to find a job there, and for highly skilled people, wages are higher. But many people have one (or more full-time jobs) and are still poor. In France, most people with jobs are not poor. But many high-skilled people leave the country (brain drain). No system is “better.” There are always tradeoffs. The US labor market is more dynamic, with working people a major issue. In France, labor markets are more sclerotic, and unemployment is a major issue.

Slides can be freely downloaded here but the book explains these issues in more details, of course: https://rzeidandotcom.files.wordpress.com/2018/11/chapter-2-slides1.pdf

 

[Texasmade]

Yes this is what I was reffering to. Is that an extreme ask for the shoemaker to match the scales? Or is a general uniformity more than acceptable, id imagine the cost to get a perfect match would be borderline inhumane.

Otherwise all the other gripes in the article made sense to me.

Scales should reasonably match and you shouldn't have to ask the shoemaker to do this. They should already know to do this. The loafers were pretty far off from left to right.

It's like asking your tailor to make sure the sleeves' pattern matches each other and the body. If the tailor doesn't match this then the tailor's attention to detail is really lacking.

 

[JohnMRobie]

Found the discussion with Berluti where Jesper interviewed Jean-Michel Casalonga and the topic came up throughout. For an hour long discussion I think it occupied about half of the chat.

 

[hoodog]

Pardon my ignorance but, how does one match the grain on crocodile leather on two pairs of shoes, lol?

It's pretty easy actually

 

[ryannn]

First quote I said is true. He’s very sensitive now and is still good at writing and I’d still read his writing about clothes. Second quote was sarcasm clearly. Third quote is true.

You proved my point by sifting through my posts just to make that post. You’re a cornball fam 😄 sitting here quoting his twitter telling people “he’s fine”. I hold internet grudges like you wear internet capes defending menswear writers.

You’re constantly posting in a thread dedicated to a guy who doesn’t like you and has you blocked. And you’re trying to call some guy a meat rider?

 

[Texasmade]

Found the discussion with Berluti where Jesper interviewed Jean-Michel Casalonga and the topic came up throughout. For an hour long discussion I think it occupied about half of the chat.

Speaking of Berulti, Kirby Allison is doing a series on Berluti. He released his first episode last Sunday talking with Jean-Michel.

 

[SimonC]

Scales should reasonably match and you shouldn't have to ask the shoemaker to do this. They should already know to do this. The loafers were pretty far off from left to right.

It's like asking your tailor to make sure the sleeves' pattern matches each other and the body. If the tailor doesn't match this then the tailor's attention to detail is really lacking.

Cleverley has got really sloppy on this - they posted a series of pairs of bespoke crocogator slip-ons on Instagram (stories, so can’t repost) last week and most of them were blatantly mismatched