Cars We Drive!

[GreenFrog]



I'd be very curious to see what the actual (closed) sales prices are for ZHPs, as opposed to the asking prices.

GF: are you on E46F?

I am in that I'm on there daily, looking for ZHPs in the classifieds section. But I don't actively post or engage in the community.

 

[VaderDave]



I am in that I'm on there daily, looking for ZHPs in the classifieds section. But I don't actively post or engage in the community.

Ah. Well, good luck in your search! I've got a 2004 ZHP convertible and I post on the forum (mostly OT) quite a bit.

 

[Rumpelstiltskin]

[VIDEO][/VIDEO]

 

[GreenFrog]



Ah. Well, good luck in your search! I've got a 2004 ZHP convertible and I post on the forum (mostly OT) quite a bit.

Thanks brah.

Speaking of search, thoughts on this gem, brahs?

http://southbend.craigslist.org/cto/5118626349.html

12.5k for a 61k miler is a pretty damn good deal in my books. Hate the interior color, tho.

 

[Huntsman]

That said, whether you think ZHPs are overpriced in general is completely your opinion and valid. I hate to be that guy, but they will fetch what the market will bear. The reason why ZHPs are so "overpriced" to some people is because they produced relatively few of them, and the demand for them is rather high. So, it's a classic demand outstripping supply problem, thereby resulting in a higher price.

The production numbers I've read state that only 7,200~ ZHPs in were produced for the US, whereas roughly 42,000 E46 M3s were produced. That's a pretty stark difference.

Yes, but we often fetishize the "market" as if it was the great equalizer it purports to be -- which it isn't, because people are not rational and do not realistically think at the margins. Most any collectible or otherwise specialized "market" will have spikes out of proportion to, shall we say, more objective measures of value, for reasons which are market-driven but which are not necessarily rational. I think that's the point. The ZHP's are rare(ish) and special, but what is being expressed is a seeming scalar inconsistency between the market price (asked) and the known distinctions that make it rare and special. Which is not an argument of merit, only one of degree.

Quote:
No. Everything is most certainly not. "Collector's editions" are artificially limited, because there was an intent to create a limited volume in order that some measure of value would remain high, independent of the true ability to simply make more. Ferraris, for instance, are artifcially limited (to a set number) while Fords are not -- Ford will sell as many as they can reasonably make, where Ferrari will sell a fixed number for reasons unrelated to true supply/demand and their production capacity.

It's a snowball rolling downhill. The next seller sees these stupid asking prices and thinks, well that's what the market will bear. I wonder how long their cars sit there unsold...

Yeah. I have a friend in Philly, where, apparently, the Pope is going to visit soon, and there is all this guff about people listing their houses for five figures (and even six and seven!) for rent for the week of the Papal visit in the news, because the hotels are supposedly all sold out. But no-one he knows has any takers even on the low end of that range. It's all the reports of asking prices that reinforce that the world of asking prices is really high, when, in reality, that's just the ASKING PRICE. Presenting a fat juicy worm does not imply that the fish will bite it.

The problem is, of course, that eventually there is nothing left but the fat worms if the fish want to eat.

And then the bubble bursts, eventually.

~ H

 

[Huntsman]

Today's work was the Meguiar's #7 polish, the rear wheels, and all the interstitial places: doorsills, the sills around the hatch, the hood, et al. Then the interior with Aerospace 303 and Chambers Leather Milk, followed by Armour-All on my shift and e-brake boots, because, dammit, I like a shiny boot!

I moved the car back to its bay because there is nothing I can do until the Dr. Color Chip comes in -- and after that, I have to wait ten days to seal it. Should have picked up this project in December.

~ H

 

[ramuman]



Screw you brah. We're no longer friends.

If it's special and you know it, raise your hands!

Isn't everything 'artificially limited'?

Dumbest thing I've heard all week.

Blasphemy!

Curious - what exactly makes the ZHP special? I'm not the smartest guy in the world.

 

[zippyh]

Screw you brah. We're no longer friends.

If it's special and you know it, raise your hands!

Isn't everything 'artificially limited'?

Dumbest thing I've heard all week.

Blasphemy!

Curious - what exactly makes the ZHP special? I'm not the smartest guy in the world.

10HP, M body kit, available Imola red paint, and a bewildering sense of superiority over lesser E46.

 

[venividivicibj]

And still not as good as an M3.

What is the price differential between Zhp and m3? If it's not much, just go to m3

 

[dah328]

Curious - what exactly makes the ZHP special? I'm not the smartest guy in the world.

10HP, M body kit, available Imola red paint, and a bewildering sense of superiority over lesser E46.

With the cams, gearing, and tuning, they drive a lot better than a regular E46 330i/is.

And still not as good as an M3.

What is the price differential between Zhp and m3? If it's not much, just go to m3

Certainly they are no M3 nor worth anywhere near as much. They are a great value when you find a seller (as I did) who does not know what a ZHP is and who lists it as a regular 330i.

 

[HRoi]

They're coming out from the woodwork! Run!!

 

[dah328]

I'm going to enlist AY in this discussion (most likely against his will):

ZHP has hotter cams, different software, different springs and dampers, along with different interior and exterior cosmetics. 10 HP on paper doesn't sound like much but the car drives more differently than its specs would suggest. I remember when they first came out and someone brought a very new one to the racetrack. We all thought it wouldn't be a big deal, because of its modest specs, but it was a very impressive car, almost a good substitute for not having a 4-door E46 M3.

It's a cult car, but fully deserving of its reputation. And it's great when people keep and take care of their cars. The environmental cost of manufacturing new cars is something most people don't consider when they buy a hybrid or some other high MPG car in order to be more environmentally friendly.

As for overpriced, who cares? If someone's willing to pay the price, then it doesn't really matter.

 

[GreenFrog]

I just like how the ZHP looks and drives. Why is that so blasphemous?

 

[otc]

I'm with GF here...

It looks a little nicer than a normal 3 series. Maybe it drives noticeably better with the few hardware changes. Comes with 4 doors instead of 2.

I don't think anybody is saying it is faster or better performing than an M3 (unless they are delusional) but it also costs a lot less than an M3 in similar condition. Maybe the asking price on some of them is a little crazy vs a 330i, but how much would you have to spend to make the same cosmetic mods to a 330 and ensure the paint matches? What kind of hit on the resale value would you take after making similar performance mods?

Sure, some internet forum people get super obsessed with them...but they seem like a pretty decent choice. Not everybody needs the power of an M3 and the ZHP gives you a lot of the sportiness with a little more practicality, for less money.

 

[whiteslashasian]

I think it's fine for a single compromise car that combines practicality and sportiness in one, but the premium is often a tad out of line for what you get imo. I guess there aren't too many fun cars in that size and price range that are actually worth driving.

I plan on eventually having a multi car garage, so for me the clear choice would be to have a dedicated weekend sports car to go along with a daily driver/highway cruiser.