Anyone help me find a nice brown causual jacket?

[Stylewords]

I think you need your eyes checked.

No. I'm fairly sure that the OP, who has actually worn and seen the jacket buttoned up, wrote the words I quoted. I'm sure my eyes read them right.

 

[dieworkwear]

No. I'm fairly sure that the OP, who has actually worn and seen the jacket buttoned up, wrote the words I quoted. I'm sure my eyes read them right.

I'm genuinely surprised that on a website called StyleForum, someone can post that jacket, and no fewer than two people say "you just need to shorten the sleeves."

One person, after having seen the photos, goes with the OP when he says it feels trim when buttoned.

This reminds me of a time when someone on here said they've been wearing size 11 shoes their whole adult life and just found out that they're actually a size 7.

 

[Stylewords]

You suggested the jacket was two or three sizes too big. My appreciation of the photo was different. The owner of the jacket settled the debate by informing us that it fits snugly. No more to discuss. As you say, it's only a forum about clothes - let's not take it too seriously.

 

[dieworkwear]

You suggested the jacket was two or three sizes too big. My appreciation of the photo was different. The owner of the jacket settled the debate by informing us that it fits snugly. No more to discuss. As you say, it's only a forum about clothes - let's not take it too seriously.

In the same post, the OP also mentioned that the shoulders fit snugly.

Thanks - no it definitely doesn't feel two or three sizes too big. Buttoned up, it fits me pretty snugly on my chest and shoulders.

I think it's clear that the shoulders don't fit snugly, as the jacket has a dropped shoulder seam.

The OP also mentioned that he wanted a sleek jacket similar to the look he's seen at Reiss and All Saints, which are two contemporary brands. Whether that look suits him, who knows. But shortening the sleeves on this Golden Bear will not get you to this:

 

[Stylewords]

In the same post, the OP also mentioned that the shoulders fit snugly.



I think it's clear that the shoulders don't fit snugly, as the jacket has a dropped shoulder seam.

The OP also mentioned that he wanted a sleek jacket similar to the look he's seen at Reiss and All Saints, which are two contemporary brands. Whether that look suits him, who knows. But shortening the sleeves on this Golden Bear will not get you to this:

View attachment 1459819
View attachment 1459821

I'm glad you now agree that the jacket is not 2 or 3 sizes too big.

 

[dieworkwear]

I'm glad you now agree that the jacket is not 2 or 3 sizes too big.

gentlemen, nice forum you have here. may i get feedback on this suit? i believe i only need to take up the sleeves

here is a drawing of how my clothes fit, along with my lunch

 

[Stylewords]

To the OP: sorry your thread has gone off in a strange direction. I believe that the jacket has potential if you can get the sleeves slimmed at a reasonable cost. As you said, the colour and texture are good. It's up to you.

 

[Daniel Hakimi]

If you don't want to stretch your budget too much, and still want to get something new, consider non-suede options.

Yeossal makes a lot of really nice ones. Those are mto, they're all available in multiple shades of brown.

Poszetka makes a really cool brown cord safari jacket.

Portuguese Flannel makes some cool jackets.

 

[Mr Tickle]

I'm a big believer that people should abandon their obsession with quality and just go by their eye.

There is such a thing as quality. But to the degree it matters, it manifests itself in how something looks.

Truly low-quaity garments -- meaning, things that may fall apart -- are sold through Amazon and fast fashion houses. But if you're interested in clothes, you're probably avoiding those anyway.

Anything above those tiers won't fall apart in the literal sense of the word. But they may look bad. To the degree quality matters, it should manifest itself in how something looks and feels on you. And you can judge those things directly by just developing your eye.

There are probably thousands of "good" suede jackets on the market. I think the challenge is finding one that fits your sense of style and works for your wardrobe. It's hard to answer that question for you since it's very subjective. Some jackets lean contemporary, others classic, some workwear-y, some elegant, etc. I would start by trying to figure out how you want to dress, and then finding the right jacket for that aesthetic. Let quality be a second or even third consideration. Quality should flow from aesthetics.

Some options, to start:

Suede Valstarino. Reasonably elegant. Can substitute for a sport coat nowadays, depending on your lifestyle. Works for guys who are sort of conservative in thier sensibility and like things that are "classic." Downside: suede shows its wear easily, and these sort of "elegant" jackets don't always look great when they're old and beat up. They're often better when they're new.


View attachment 1459702
View attachment 1459703

View attachment 1459709


Suede trucker. Mine is from Barbanera (pictured below). You can also find them from Ralph Lauren and Levis. The style here leans a bit more rugged than the jacket above. Good with slim jeans and boots. Another upside: workwear styled jackets such as this one get better with age, so you don't have to worry when you stain them. The more dirt stains, the better.

View attachment 1459706
View attachment 1459707


Contemporary. Let's call this contemporary, as it's basically "updated takes on classics." Kind of a vague and fuzzy term, but one of those "you know it when you see it." Sandro can be a good starrting place if you're on a budget

View attachment 1459708
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There are a ton of possible styles. I would start with trying to figure out how you want to dress, and then choose a jacket from that. Don't start with "I want a brown suede jacket and for it to be good quality." Quality can be a fuzzy concept and it mostly flows from aesthetics anyway. Figure out how you want to look.

Sorry for the long delayed reply, but I didn't check in on this thread for a while, and truth be told I have moved on from the jacket we were discussing - but your very thoughtful and useful post deserves a response.
Thanks for the run-through of different styles of suede jacket. This is relevant to my interests. So, of the styles there, the valstarino is closest to what I'm looking for. Actual Valstarino is quite considerably above my budget though. But something that gives the same effect at a cut down price would be great.

Regarding your comments about quality. They are certainly interesting. I am not sure I 100% understand your point , though (though I would like to - what I do understand, makes sense.)

Your gist seems to be that "look" is the major indicator of quality. But to my eye, the mid-tier, mass market high street brands that I am trying to level up from (as mentioned, Reiss, All Saints, Paul Smith etc) make clothes that look very good. At least, they look good in website photos, and on the shelves of the store, and for the first few months they are owned. The differentiator between them and what I would consider actual high quality rtw clothing (John Smedley, Private White, Drakes) is how they hold up to repeated wear. To give a real-life working example - I have two navy blue, 100% Merino wool v-neck jumpers, one is from Barbour (what I would consider a mass market high street brand these days, when it comes to clothing that isn't it's signature jackets) and one is John Smedley (which generally seems to be held in higher regard as a purveyor of high quality, premium-priced, Uk-made products). When they were new , if you had cut the labels off them I would struggle to tell you which one was which. But after six months of regular wear and several washes, the Barbour is faded, warped out of shape and frumpish. Whereas the JS still looks sleek and as good as new.
I have no idea why this is. They are both made from exactly the same material and knitted in exactly the same pattern (from what I can tell).

 

[dieworkwear]

Sorry for the long delayed reply, but I didn't check in on this thread for a while, and truth be told I have moved on from the jacket we were discussing - but your very thoughtful and useful post deserves a response.
Thanks for the run-through of different styles of suede jacket. This is relevant to my interests. So, of the styles there, the valstarino is closest to what I'm looking for. Actual Valstarino is quite considerably above my budget though. But something that gives the same effect at a cut down price would be great.

Regarding your comments about quality. They are certainly interesting. I am not sure I 100% understand your point , though (though I would like to - what I do understand, makes sense.)

Your gist seems to be that "look" is the major indicator of quality. But to my eye, the mid-tier, mass market high street brands that I am trying to level up from (as mentioned, Reiss, All Saints, Paul Smith etc) make clothes that look very good. At least, they look good in website photos, and on the shelves of the store, and for the first few months they are owned. The differentiator between them and what I would consider actual high quality rtw clothing (John Smedley, Private White, Drakes) is how they hold up to repeated wear. To give a real-life working example - I have two navy blue, 100% Merino wool v-neck jumpers, one is from Barbour (what I would consider a mass market high street brand these days, when it comes to clothing that isn't it's signature jackets) and one is John Smedley (which generally seems to be held in higher regard as a purveyor of high quality, premium-priced, Uk-made products). When they were new , if you had cut the labels off them I would struggle to tell you which one was which. But after six months of regular wear and several washes, the Barbour is faded, warped out of shape and frumpish. Whereas the JS still looks sleek and as good as new.
I have no idea why this is. They are both made from exactly the same material and knitted in exactly the same pattern (from what I can tell).

Quality is somewhat of a complicated issue.

With some things, such as knitted garments, quality will often reveal itself over time. That's because knitwear is made from yarns, which are knitted into a fabric and then made into clothes. Those yarns are made from fibers (e.g. cotton, wool, cashmere, etc) that are twisted together. When the yarn is made from shorter fibers, it's prone to small breakages, which is what results in pilling. When you're looking at a garment in the store, you can't tell if the yarn is made from shorter or longer fibers, which is why it's important to depend on the reputation of the brand.

Additionally, sweaters can be made with more or less slack. That is to say, they can be knitted more or less densely. A company may knit something loosely for design purposes (mostly happens in very high-fashion, conceptual knits). Or, more commonly, it's done to save on material. If you can save just a little bit of material in making each garment, you can save the company a lot of money. So cheaper producers will knit a sweater more loosely (more slack/ less densely). When you take the sweater home and wear it for a while, it will stretch out easily.

There are other things that go into the quality of the sweater, but those are the basics.

There are other areas of quality. Shoes are generally better when they're made from full grain leather, rather than corrected. Suits and sport coats are generally better when they're fully canvassed, rather than fused.

However, I think a lot of guys learn these basics about quality, and then they go out and shop for clothes like they're shopping for electronics. They compare things in terms of build quality, and then just buy the thing that's the "highest tier" of quality given their budget. I think this is a bad way to build a wardrobe.

For quality to mean something, it should manifest in how the garment looks and feels on you. The most important aspect of quality isn't even in the build quality itself, but in the design. If you buy a trendy garment, the design will give out before the build quality. But this isn't to say that you should avoid all trends, either. I think it's more important to find stuff that looks good on you, makes you feel good, and works for lifestyle.

I think some men sometimes poo-poo women's fashion because they think women don't know anything about quality garments, or they don't know how to shop. There's an old trope in fashion writing that men are more attuned to longer lasting, quality garments, and women chase trends. But I think women -- at least the ones who know how to dress well -- actually have it right. Shopping is very much about taste. You find what looks good on you, be honest about how you look, find stuff that makes you feel good, and be self-reflective about what you'll wear. In this way, you can get a sense of quality by just being sensitive to these dimensions, shopping around, trying things on, etc.

Peter Nguyen is a stylist who has worked with a somewhat well known designer named Robert Geller. Peter has also designed his own line of leather jackets. He wrote a guide once on Effortless Gent on what makes a "quality leather jacket," which you can see here:

The Ultimate Guide To Buying A Leather Jacket · Effortless Gent

Looking to own a leather jacket that will last a lifetime? This article will cover everything you need to know about buying a leather jacket.

effortlessgent.com

Take a look at what might increase the cost of manufacturing a jacket: topstitching the pockets. When you look at a jacket, you may find that some styles have certain details, such as topstitching to help make the pocket visually pop.

But do you really need to know this when shopping for a jacket? I'd argue that you can spot this by just training your eye for what looks good. Unless you're buying at the very low end of the spectrum, such as H&M and Zara, most leather jackets will last you fine. Some jackets are made from heavier or stiffer leathers, such as cowhide (stiff and heavy) rather than lambskin (soft and buttery). Sometimes, you'll see guys equate the weight of a leather jacket with quality, but I again think this is better thought of as taste. Some guys want a soft, buttery lambskin jacket they can wear to a wine bar. They don't want to wear something stiff and heavy, or will make them look like a tough biker. I think you get a sense of what you prefer by just trying things on.

A few years ago, I got interested in riding motorcycles and asked a friend for direction on what to buy (he's an avid motorcycle rider). He put it simply: buy something affordable for now and use that as a baseline for your next purchase. Figure out what you like or don't like about your current ride. Develop a sense of taste. I think this is similar to building a wardrobe, buying fragrances, buying fountain pens, or really any area of culture. If you were to buy books, would you buy the stories that are "the highest quality?" Same with buying art, buying records, etc. A lot of this stuff is about taste.

 

[mhip]

Quality is somewhat of a complicated issue.

With some things, such as knitted garments, quality will often reveal itself over time. That's because knitwear is made from yarns, which are knitted into a fabric and then made into clothes. Those yarns are made from fibers (e.g. cotton, wool, cashmere, etc) that are twisted together. When the yarn is made from shorter fibers, it's prone to small breakages, which is what results in pilling. When you're looking at a garment in the store, you can't tell if the yarn is made from shorter or longer fibers, which is why it's important to depend on the reputation of the brand.

Additionally, sweaters can be made with more or less slack. That is to say, they can be knitted more or less densely. A company may knit something loosely for design purposes (mostly happens in very high-fashion, conceptual knits). Or, more commonly, it's done to save on material. If you can save just a little bit of material in making each garment, you can save the company a lot of money. So cheaper producers will knit a sweater more loosely (more slack/ less densely). When you take the sweater home and wear it for a while, it will stretch out easily.

There are other things that go into the quality of the sweater, but those are the basics.

There are other areas of quality. Shoes are generally better when they're made from full grain leather, rather than corrected. Suits and sport coats are generally better when they're fully canvassed, rather than fused.

However, I think a lot of guys learn these basics about quality, and then they go out and shop for clothes like they're shopping for electronics. They compare things in terms of build quality, and then just buy the thing that's the "highest tier" of quality given their budget. I think this is a bad way to build a wardrobe.

For quality to mean something, it should manifest in how the garment looks and feels on you. The most important aspect of quality isn't even in the build quality itself, but in the design. If you buy a trendy garment, the design will give out before the build quality. But this isn't to say that you should avoid all trends, either. I think it's more important to find stuff that looks good on you, makes you feel good, and works for lifestyle.

I think some men sometimes poo-poo women's fashion because they think women don't know anything about quality garments, or they don't know how to shop. There's an old trope in fashion writing that men are more attuned to longer lasting, quality garments, and women chase trends. But I think women -- at least the ones who know how to dress well -- actually have it right. Shopping is very much about taste. You find what looks good on you, be honest about how you look, find stuff that makes you feel good, and be self-reflective about what you'll wear. In this way, you can get a sense of quality by just being sensitive to these dimensions, shopping around, trying things on, etc.

Peter Nguyen is a stylist who has worked with a somewhat well known designer named Robert Geller. Peter has also designed his own line of leather jackets. He wrote a guide once on Effortless Gent on what makes a "quality leather jacket," which you can see here:

The Ultimate Guide To Buying A Leather Jacket · Effortless Gent

Looking to own a leather jacket that will last a lifetime? This article will cover everything you need to know about buying a leather jacket.

effortlessgent.com

Take a look at what might increase the cost of manufacturing a jacket: topstitching the pockets. When you look at a jacket, you may find that some styles have certain details, such as topstitching to help make the pocket visually pop.

View attachment 1475383 View attachment 1475384


But do you really need to know this when shopping for a jacket? I'd argue that you can spot this by just training your eye for what looks good. Unless you're buying at the very low end of the spectrum, such as H&M and Zara, most leather jackets will last you fine. Some jackets are made from heavier or stiffer leathers, such as cowhide (stiff and heavy) rather than lambskin (soft and buttery). Sometimes, you'll see guys equate the weight of a leather jacket with quality, but I again think this is better thought of as taste. Some guys want a soft, buttery lambskin jacket they can wear to a wine bar. They don't want to wear something stiff and heavy, or will make them look like a tough biker. I think you get a sense of what you prefer by just trying things on.

To my eye, Reiss, All Saints, and Paul Smith jackets just don't look very good. Aside from quality, I juts don't think they make the wearers look all that great. But if someone felt different, I wouldn't say they're objectively wrong. A lot of this is just about having a point of view and developing a sense of taste.

I just ordered an All Saints suede bomber.
I've been wanting one ( a jacket ) in tan, and with the sale it was $249.
It was a compromise with myself after too many Tom Ford fragrances and a pair of JMM's.
Will advise when it gets here tomorrow on how sexy I look...

 

[dieworkwear]

I just ordered an All Saints suede bomber.
I've been wanting one ( a jacket ) in tan, and with the sale it was $249.
It was a compromise with myself after too many Tom Ford fragrances and a pair of JMM's.
Will advise when it gets here tomorrow on how sexy I look...

I can't afford All Saints, so I buy Half Saints.

 

[mhip]

I can't afford All Saints, so I buy Half Saints.

Like a Halter Saint?
Pics!

 

[Mr Tickle]

I just ordered an All Saints suede bomber.
I've been wanting one ( a jacket ) in tan, and with the sale it was $249.
It was a compromise with myself after too many Tom Ford fragrances and a pair of JMM's.
Will advise when it gets here tomorrow on how sexy I look...

Looking forward to seeing this, if you are going to post a pic - as I was looking at All Saints suede jackets on sale too - but they didn't have a colour I want.

 

[Mr Tickle]

Again

Quality is somewhat of a complicated issue.

With some things, such as knitted garments, quality will often reveal itself over time. That's because knitwear is made from yarns, which are knitted into a fabric and then made into clothes. Those yarns are made from fibers (e.g. cotton, wool, cashmere, etc) that are twisted together. When the yarn is made from shorter fibers, it's prone to small breakages, which is what results in pilling. When you're looking at a garment in the store, you can't tell if the yarn is made from shorter or longer fibers, which is why it's important to depend on the reputation of the brand.

Additionally, sweaters can be made with more or less slack. That is to say, they can be knitted more or less densely. A company may knit something loosely for design purposes (mostly happens in very high-fashion, conceptual knits). Or, more commonly, it's done to save on material. If you can save just a little bit of material in making each garment, you can save the company a lot of money. So cheaper producers will knit a sweater more loosely (more slack/ less densely). When you take the sweater home and wear it for a while, it will stretch out easily.

There are other things that go into the quality of the sweater, but those are the basics.

There are other areas of quality. Shoes are generally better when they're made from full grain leather, rather than corrected. Suits and sport coats are generally better when they're fully canvassed, rather than fused.

However, I think a lot of guys learn these basics about quality, and then they go out and shop for clothes like they're shopping for electronics. They compare things in terms of build quality, and then just buy the thing that's the "highest tier" of quality given their budget. I think this is a bad way to build a wardrobe.

For quality to mean something, it should manifest in how the garment looks and feels on you. The most important aspect of quality isn't even in the build quality itself, but in the design. If you buy a trendy garment, the design will give out before the build quality. But this isn't to say that you should avoid all trends, either. I think it's more important to find stuff that looks good on you, makes you feel good, and works for lifestyle.

I think some men sometimes poo-poo women's fashion because they think women don't know anything about quality garments, or they don't know how to shop. There's an old trope in fashion writing that men are more attuned to longer lasting, quality garments, and women chase trends. But I think women -- at least the ones who know how to dress well -- actually have it right. Shopping is very much about taste. You find what looks good on you, be honest about how you look, find stuff that makes you feel good, and be self-reflective about what you'll wear. In this way, you can get a sense of quality by just being sensitive to these dimensions, shopping around, trying things on, etc.

Peter Nguyen is a stylist who has worked with a somewhat well known designer named Robert Geller. Peter has also designed his own line of leather jackets. He wrote a guide once on Effortless Gent on what makes a "quality leather jacket," which you can see here:

The Ultimate Guide To Buying A Leather Jacket · Effortless Gent

Looking to own a leather jacket that will last a lifetime? This article will cover everything you need to know about buying a leather jacket.

effortlessgent.com

Take a look at what might increase the cost of manufacturing a jacket: topstitching the pockets. When you look at a jacket, you may find that some styles have certain details, such as topstitching to help make the pocket visually pop.

View attachment 1475383 View attachment 1475384


But do you really need to know this when shopping for a jacket? I'd argue that you can spot this by just training your eye for what looks good. Unless you're buying at the very low end of the spectrum, such as H&M and Zara, most leather jackets will last you fine. Some jackets are made from heavier or stiffer leathers, such as cowhide (stiff and heavy) rather than lambskin (soft and buttery). Sometimes, you'll see guys equate the weight of a leather jacket with quality, but I again think this is better thought of as taste. Some guys want a soft, buttery lambskin jacket they can wear to a wine bar. They don't want to wear something stiff and heavy, or will make them look like a tough biker. I think you get a sense of what you prefer by just trying things on.

A few years ago, I got interested in riding motorcycles and asked a friend for direction on what to buy (he's an avid motorcycle rider). He put it simply: buy something affordable for now and use that as a baseline for your next purchase. Figure out what you like or don't like about your current ride. Develop a sense of taste. I think this is similar to building a wardrobe, buying fragrances, buying fountain pens, or really any area of culture. If you were to buy books, would you buy the stories that are "the highest quality?" Same with buying art, buying records, etc. A lot of this stuff is about taste.

Again, thank you for the very informative post.
I like to think I am at the stage of moving beyond "go out and look for clothes like they are shopping for electronics". I have a wardrobe full of Paul Smith, Hugo Boss (office wear), Ted Baker, Reiss, Calvin Klein etc. Clothes that were clearly bought by someone who was trying to "dress well" (otherwise I would have just bought H&M or Zara) but without a real understanding of the full spectrum of what's available in the menswear market. Hence being drawn towards big names and heavily marketed brands - which would once have been known, I guess, as "designer" clothing (a meaningless term best left in the 20th century where it was born in my opinion). These clothes often looked great (to me) and I'm used to getting compliments on how I dress, and having friends ask me for clothing advice. Obviously compared to the average poster here I'm an amateur, but I'm hoping to level up.

Ps everything I have bought in the last 8 months has been casual wear - I don't forsee the need for formal/ business dress in the near future and my suits have some life left in them.
Anyway experts such as yourself, Phileas Fogg and Stylewords have helped make this a lot of fun so thank you!