The Watch Appreciation Thread - Part two (Rolex, Patek Philippe, Audemars Piguet, Jaeger LeCoultre,

[Michigan Planner]

^ I saw somebody on Instagram swap the bezels and I think it the tegimented bezel looks great on the Professional - it somehow seems to provide more contrast. If I were a more brave man, I'd give it a shot on my own.

 

[Keith T]

Lol @ no frills popping in and thinking that PMW might be a new brand or something.

WE STILL MISS YOU FRILLY! Ha ha.

But PMW is not a new addition to the holy trinity of watchmaking

 

[Mr. Moo]

 

[CHRK33]

Friends, if anyone might be interested in the JLC Geophysic 1958 and missed out, I am parting with mine that is in pristine condition and full set. I will give any of you guys a great price as this community means a lot to me. I just had a daughter and priorities have shifted. Feel free to PM.

 

[cyc wid it]

3940 from my birth year just landed at a popular retailer...

 

[XKxRome0ox]

Just received the new Rolex Daytona as an early wedding gift from my fiancee
I had to do the legwork and find it ... she wrote the check
It's my first Rolex ... but hopefully not the last

 

[Mr Tewkesbury]

3940 from my birth year just landed at a popular retailer...

And you're here chatting about it?.. get your skates on
It is, in my eyes, the ultimate PP classic (or perhaps the WT or column chrono... oh, so many...). But the year of your birth is the ultimate justification!

 

[TheFoo]

Lets talk watches. I'm game if you all are.

Been reading old discussion threads across the internet relating to finishing and consequently feel the urge to slam face through wall. I am now certain that Philippe Dufour is an evil Swiss troll beset on the internet watch enthusiast comunity to spread odoriferous, hysteric, myopia. Kudos to the practicioner of the dark arts who can hand-chamfer the most flawless bevels over the most challenging inward angles. But you know what? Patek and the like do the same **** pretty good too. Not god-level good, but good enough to be enviable. Does Lange do even a little better? Maybe the bevels are sharper and the stripes are even more clearly define. But then you are stuck looking at a 3/4 plate most of the time. Where the **** is the fun of that? Germans.

Point is, it is blatant forum groupthink that targets Patek for bashing. I think they do more right than wrong, and when they are right, they put out some of the most sublime watches ever made.

Now, you may not like Patek for a bunch of other reasons which could be perfectly valid. But come one--finishng is "not good" anymore? This is like rejecting a world renowned tailor because his pick stitch is nice enough but you've seen even better.

Watchmakers have to make compromises with limited time and resources. For example, FP Journe follows a calculated strategy of de-emphazing finishing in order to invest more in movement design and development--which, by the way, happens to fall in-line with an older watchmaker you may have heard of by the name of Breguet. Breguet watches are, rightfully, some of the most revered of all time--and yet the finishing is meh at best. The man was after innovation more than anything else.

The nice thing about a big shop like Patek or Lange is that they have so many resources to bear. They may not ever reach Dufour levels of finishing, buy they manage to be pretty damned good along all measures.

I think if you're critiquing a Patek because the finishing of its movement is not quite as fine as a Lange under 10x magnification, the cheese has fallen off your cracker and you've stopped loving watches the way they deserve. Like women. We may want to stare only at their **** and then compare to other nicer **** we saw elsewhere, but then you get no ****, and ultimately no beautiful woman. It's okay to like ****, but remember the rest counts too.

 

[mimo]

The criticism of Patek more recently, on this thread at least, has been about more fundamental issues of design: some of their limited "sporty" models, and very specifically, their use of lazy generic fonts on six-figure larger modern versions of their mainstay chronos and calendars. I feel more strongly about the latter, though as I'll almost certainly never own either, I'm sure Mr Stern doesn't give a toss what I think.

There is still plenty of love here for the brand, clearly (see above). Maybe the latest editions are just trying too hard. They shouldn't have to.

new Rolex Daytona as an early wedding gift...my first Rolex

What a way to start!

 

[Mr Tewkesbury]

Lets talk watches. I'm game if you all are.

Been reading old discussion threads across the internet relating to finishing and consequently feel the urge to slam face through wall. I am now certain that Philippe Dufour is an evil Swiss troll beset on the internet watch enthusiast comunity to spread odoriferous, hysteric, myopia. Kudos to the practicioner of the dark arts who can hand-chamfer the most flawless bevels over the most challenging inward angles. But you know what? Patek and the like do the same **** pretty good too. Not god-level good, but good enough to be enviable. Does Lange do even a little better? Maybe the bevels are sharper and the stripes are even more clearly define. But then you are stuck looking at a 3/4 plate most of the time. Where the **** is the fun of that? Germans.

Point is, it is blatant forum groupthink that targets Patek for bashing. I think they do more right than wrong, and when they are right, they put out some of the most sublime watches ever made.

Now, you may not like Patek for a bunch of other reasons which could be perfectly valid. But come one--finishng is "not good" anymore? This is like rejecting a world renowned tailor because his pick stitch is nice enough but you've seen even better.

Watchmakers have to make compromises with limited time and resources. For example, FP Journe follows a calculated strategy of de-emphazing finishing in order to invest more in movement design and development--which, by the way, happens to fall in-line with an older watchmaker you may have heard of by the name of Breguet. Breguet watches are, rightfully, some of the most revered of all time--and yet the finishing is meh at best. The man was after innovation more than anything else.

The nice thing about a big shop like Patek or Lange is that they have so many resources to bear. They may not ever reach Dufour levels of finishing, buy they manage to be pretty damned good along all measures.

I think if you're critiquing a Patek because the finishing of its movement is not quite as fine as a Lange under 10x magnification, the cheese has fallen off your cracker and you've stopped loving watches the way they deserve. Like women. We may want to stare only at their **** and then compare to other nicer **** we saw elsewhere, but then you get no ****, and ultimately no beautiful woman. It's okay to like ****, but remember the rest counts too.

I am no horologist, but have watched the market for a while now. Patek have taken a less polished approach to more than one model of late. Actually for a while. PD's work in sublime and is not a fair comparison to a company that caps their production to 50,000 units p.a..
The latest perpetual calendar offering does not have inward angles, I find that disturbing at that level and price.
Buyer beware, more often than not purchases are now made for brash statism - hence the rise of Hublot (not bashing the brand, but meteroric populosm that it has achieved needs to be noted - not meritorious), the production values may have fallen due to an attempt to pump the numbers out.... the snowball cascades down the slope growing at an exponential rate...
Just an observation, shoot down at leisure.

 

[benf]

Lets talk watches. I'm game if you all are.

Been reading old discussion threads across the internet relating to finishing and consequently feel the urge to slam face through wall. I am now certain that Philippe Dufour is an evil Swiss troll beset on the internet watch enthusiast comunity to spread odoriferous, hysteric, myopia. Kudos to the practicioner of the dark arts who can hand-chamfer the most flawless bevels over the most challenging inward angles. But you know what? Patek and the like do the same **** pretty good too. Not god-level good, but good enough to be enviable. Does Lange do even a little better? Maybe the bevels are sharper and the stripes are even more clearly define. But then you are stuck looking at a 3/4 plate most of the time. Where the **** is the fun of that? Germans.

Point is, it is blatant forum groupthink that targets Patek for bashing. I think they do more right than wrong, and when they are right, they put out some of the most sublime watches ever made.

Now, you may not like Patek for a bunch of other reasons which could be perfectly valid. But come one--finishng is "not good" anymore? This is like rejecting a world renowned tailor because his pick stitch is nice enough but you've seen even better.

Watchmakers have to make compromises with limited time and resources. For example, FP Journe follows a calculated strategy of de-emphazing finishing in order to invest more in movement design and development--which, by the way, happens to fall in-line with an older watchmaker you may have heard of by the name of Breguet. Breguet watches are, rightfully, some of the most revered of all time--and yet the finishing is meh at best. The man was after innovation more than anything else.

The nice thing about a big shop like Patek or Lange is that they have so many resources to bear. They may not ever reach Dufour levels of finishing, buy they manage to be pretty damned good along all measures.

I think if you're critiquing a Patek because the finishing of its movement is not quite as fine as a Lange under 10x magnification, the cheese has fallen off your cracker and you've stopped loving watches the way they deserve. Like women. We may want to stare only at their **** and then compare to other nicer **** we saw elsewhere, but then you get no ****, and ultimately no beautiful woman. It's okay to like ****, but remember the rest counts too.

I like Patek and a PC is on my list for next year (milestone year).
Here are some of my observations:
- over the past perhaps dozen years, they've lost their design language. Look at photos from the NY exhibition to see what I mean. Models like the 5524 is a case in point
- in joining the >40mm club, they've alienated a significant number of long term collectors of the brand
- finishing of the moment is of a lower standard than Lange. U don't need a loupe to see that
- for me, haute horological is about designing a watch around the movement. But the offerings have gotten larger whilst they've kept the same movements. Take the case of the 3940-5140-5327. The 240 calibre was first used in the 3940 in 1985 and it's still used in the 5327 which was released late year. Case diameter went from 36mm-37mm-39mm. The 3mm difference is highly noticeable when u turn the watch over

 

[Mr Tewkesbury]

I like Patek and a PC is on my list for next year (milestone year).
Here are some of my observations:
- over the past perhaps dozen years, they've lost their design language. Look at photos from the NY exhibition to see what I mean. Models like the 5524 is a case in point
- in joining the >40mm club, they've alienated a significant number of long term collectors of the brand
- finishing of the moment is of a lower standard than Lange. U don't need a loupe to see that
- for me, haute horological is about designing a watch around the movement. But the offerings have gotten larger whilst they've kept the same movements. Take the case of the 3940-5140-5327. The 240 calibre was first used in the 3940 in 1985 and it's still used in the 5327 which was released late year. Case diameter went from 36mm-37mm-39mm. The 3mm difference is highly noticeable when u turn the watch over

Could not agree more. The movement should not be alien to the case - float.

 

[cchen]

Foo, I think you're missing the point. I don't think many people are saying Patek finishing sucks. I think they're saying for the price, it sucks. You mentioned Lange - agreed on the 3/4 plate, but they finish to the same standard, whether it's their opening price point models or top price point. Whereas PP comes out with crap like this at their opening price (5196)

At the opening price point, you get the best value from Lange.

 

[no frills]

Re: Patek, design, and newer models.

I prefer the older models, personally.

 

[Journeyman]

Point is, it is blatant forum groupthink that targets Patek for bashing. I think they do more right than wrong, and when they are right, they put out some of the most sublime watches ever made.

Now, you may not like Patek for a bunch of other reasons which could be perfectly valid. But come one--finishng is "not good" anymore? This is like rejecting a world renowned tailor because his pick stitch is nice enough but you've seen even better.

The criticism of Patek more recently, on this thread at least, has been about more fundamental issues of design: some of their limited "sporty" models, and very specifically, their use of lazy generic fonts on six-figure larger modern versions of their mainstay chronos and calendars.

Foo, I think that you are picking a false argument here. Perhaps I've missed something but, as Mimo points out, the criticism of PP stems more from using Arial font on dials, from poor dial design, from putting a smaller movement into a larger case and so on, rather than from the PP's finishing of its movements. In fact, I can't remember anyone in this thread criticising PP for the finishing of its movements...