The Official Dieworkwear Appreciation Thread

[symphvaria]

he's doing fine

I love Derek's writing, but I find tweets like this really embarrassing. It's not a flex to brag about having to block people because you're incapable or unwilling to deal with dissent, it just speaks to being thin-skinned.

In general, I really hate microblogging and I yearn for the return of long form content, not just from DWW but from any writer who has made the unfortunate decision to transition to 240 character shitposts. The latter may be great at providing dopamine hits, but for anyone trying to actually learn as much as they can about clothing or shoes or putting together a coherent wardrobe, it becomes near impossible to follow and search up older posts, which is particularly unfortunate when the person in question has a wealth of knowledge to potentially share like Derek does.

I also can't help but notice that, due to the incredibly short lifespan of content and due to the considerably larger and less knowledgeable audience that Derek is speaking to, that he ends up repeating himself over and over and over. Yes, the Nike x Tiffany collab is insufferable, as is much of hypebeast culture, but does it really bear repeating dozens of times? Likewise with the idea that putting together a coherent look has more value than owning flashy individual items, which is actually incredibly informative and absolutely warrants deeper study; yet I've actually never seen DWW explore the idea in-depth and have mostly just seen him repeat it over and over in the form of criticizing jewel colored shoes and blingy watches. The ideas are there, but they're never elaborated on, and the result is really unsatisfactory and frustrating.

I probably sound really whiny and entitled, but I learned a lot from Derek's old website, and I'd really like to see more focused and nuanced content like that. As is, I don't think I've actually picked up anything from his twitter that wasn't already expressed either here on StyFo or on his blog.

 

[willy cheesesteak]

lmfao it’s not that deep fam

 

[symphvaria]

lmfao it’s not that deep fam

I don't think anything I said is particularly deep. Twitter not being as informative as traditional longform writing is a pretty basic idea.

 

[willy cheesesteak]

I probably sound really whiny and entitled

 

[symphvaria]

An unfortunate concession that I'm willing to make in order to express my preference for more indepth writing compared to Twitter shitposts.

 

[emptym]

Personally, I think Derek is fighting the good fight there, as he did here. He's arguing for informed, broad-minded, tasteful style that is socially and environmentally conscious. I'll take anything he's willing to give us, long or short form. And I'm glad Twitter gives him broader reach.

Could he sometimes be more patient? Sure, but so could we all, and he'd be among the first to admit it.

 

[LA Guy]

I've always hated Twitter. It's fundamentally designed to favor hot takes over thoughtfulness. Twitter under the new management is pretty unbearable. I feel like a worse person every time I am on there.

 

[Texasmade]

I've alwa

Really!?

 

[symphvaria]

Personally, I think Derek is fighting the good fight there, as here. He's arguing for informed, broad-minded, tasteful style that is socially and environmentally conscious. I'll take anything he's willing to give us, long or short. And I'm glad Twitter gives him broader reach.

Could he sometimes be more patient? Sure, but so could we all, and he'd be among the first to admit it.

I don't know if there is any fight to be fighting on Twitter moreso than there is screaming into the void. The vast, vast majority of people on Twitter do not log on to have their minds changed, they come on to puff up their chests and get into spats over meaningless trivia and technicalities. A significantly larger outreach? Yes, but to what end, when the percentage of audience engagement that is actually open to not just listening, but taking action and making changes, is absolutely miniscule?

I've always hated Twitter. It's fundamentally designed to favor hot takes over thoughtfulness. Twitter under the new management is pretty unbearable. I feel like a worse person every time I am on there.

Twitter under any management is insufferable. The very foundation of the platform is counterintuitive to in-depth discourse and nuance.

 

[odub]

having to block people because you're incapable or unwilling to deal with dissent

Respectfully but let's not treat Twitter (or any social media space) like folks are ejecting people from the Platonic Academy for disagreeing with Socrates.

The bulk of "dissent" on Twitter isn't comprised of principled disagreements between peers who respect one another. Heck, as bad as flame wars on SF can be, these look downright majestic by comparison.

That said, does one need to announce that you're out there blocking fools? Probably not. But I also don't see using a blocking tool like it's undermining the future of democratic thought.

 

[symphvaria]

I also don't see using a blocking tool like it's undermining the future of democratic thought.

No, that's not quite what I mean.

By choosing to use Twitter as your main platform, you are acknowledging and openly accepting that your main audience will be the Twitter userbase, that is to say, an absolute cesspool. You are, by default, and of your own decision, never going to get rational, intelligent discussion. This is precisely what I criticized earlier with regards to Derek's own content, but it applies to everything surrounding him as well, regardless of agreement or disagreement.

What I meant more specifically with that comment was that, given Derek's choice of platform, and therefore his choice of audience, blocking people en masse and announcing it is a really poor way of presenting your personality and character. Appearing as a charismatic authority figure on the platform is not just about being able to shout the loudest, but also about being able to refute people through wit and brevity. The latter in particular is something that traditional long form writers don't really excel in (myself included), and I suspect Derek may struggle with the same, which is why many of his responses to people's uninformed criticisms of his tweets tend to turn into massive multi-tweet threads. This isn't remotely practical or feasible given the sheer amplitude of people on Twitter who will inevitably disagree with you, especially over an extended period of time, so what is the simple and fuss-free solution? The block button, of course. And when large swathes of people begin realizing how liberal one is with blocking and begin discussing it, the result is that one begins to acquire a reputation for being petty and thin-skinned, regardless of the thought process that actually led to that situation.

Do I actually think Derek is incapable of handling dissent? Of course not, his arguments on StyFo against his topics of choice (tan oxfords with chinos and what have you) have been extremely patient, well researched, and thought out. But there's no room for that on Twitter by design. Effectively speaking, he's chosen to play a losing game that, at the moment, has dealt him a winning hand thanks to the amount of exposure he's gotten. But these sorts of things don't last, and the tables can turn pretty quickly when people begin to catch on to how trigger happy he is with his blocklist. Content creators going from beloved community figures to social media addicted, overreacting lolcows is a near staple of internet culture at this point, and all it really takes is enough people noticing and talking about one's behavior online.

 

[Spaghettimatt]

I'm not reading @symphvaria multi-paragraph screeds in full, but if one of his points is that he wishes Derek would write blog posts again, I agree. It's been almost three months since the last one on DWW. I just miss them and the Tweeting doesn't hit me the same way. I'm still hoping for a Fall/Winter Sportcoat guide.

 

[Cause Moe]

That said, does one need to announce that you're out there blocking fools? Probably not. But I also don't see using a blocking tool like it's undermining the future of democratic thought.

If you don't like a discussion, you can just stop, and walk away. The equivalent of blocking used to be called "plonking" back in the neolithic, and announcing your plonking was always considered tantamount to boasting of victory while running away.

I'm not reading @symphvaria multi-paragraph screeds in full, ...

Wow. It's a very good thing that SF isn't limited to short attention spans.

 

[LA Guy]

Content creators going from beloved community figures to social media addicted, overreacting lolcows is a near staple of internet culture at this point, and all it really takes is enough people noticing and talking about one's behavior online.

I think that this is the depressing thing about social media. The platforms are designed for virality, and anyone with a big microphone eventually becomes a demagogue, whether consiously or subconsciously.

A battery of engagement metrics is shown to you constantly, and we are easily manipulated animals.

I'm showing my age by remembering fondly my days arguing things on alt.martial-arts.

 

[JohnMRobie]

I’m going to take a contrarian view here but Derek’s exposure on Twitter is, IMO, a good thing and I think it’s unfair to distill it down to sh*tposts.

He’s engaging an audience with new information that overwhelmingly aren’t people who would ever read a menswear blog let alone step foot into even lurking on here.

Certainly there are some downsides and he’s gotta work within the confines of a less than optimal platform but it’s genuinely cool to see a whole new crop of people starting to absorb and learn and ask questions. If you take a peek at Derek’s replies not just his original tweets he’s engaging in good faith and fielding questions about all sorts of things.

I’ve had normie friends send me his tweets and ask about them, ask about different looks and brands and try to learn. These aren’t guys who would come on here. Plus maybe he’ll convince a handful of them to stop wearing dress sneakers with chinos.