The Bespoke Shoes Thread

[dieworkwear]

Yeah. That picture was terrible. Didn’t understand it at all... only reason they posted it was because it was from an Esquire fashion shoot.

As an Asian person, I find the photo offensive because the guy is wearing shoes on carpet.

 

[Stefan88]

I only have two pairs of shoes from him, with a third pair being made right now. I think they're pretty different, even though they're both Norwegian split toes. The first pair, which is made from a pebbled leather.

What strikes me with Nicholas is that he's extremely good at making casual styled shoes. His 5 eyelet plain to derbies too are amazing.

 

[Stefan88]

Very nicely thank you. It's a pair of potentially slippery GYW shoes with Japanese denim. Unfortunately, they don't rock on their heels.

If you want to say something, say it out loud else please get a life.

You need to go bespoke for the rocking. Requires faulty handwork.

 

[Zapasman]

Nicholas, as far as they do not seem the same to me, I would like to know which of the two apron seams below (I won´t use technical names) require more level of expertise/time to execute and why?.. TIA
PS.-Love your work and leathers
.

 

[DWFII]

Nicholas, as far as they do not seem the same to me, I would like to know which of the two apron seams below (I won´t use technical names) require more level of expertise/time to execute and why?.. TIA
PS.-Love your work and leathers
. View attachment 1204195

Quite obviously, I'm not Nicholas, but, IMO, the apron seams on the red pair "require more level of expertise/time to execute".

The 'technical' term for the apron stitch is "split and lift." The toe is closed by a "round stitch" on the fleshside.

They're both done by hand. To do correctly, both seams generally want a small awl (the smaller the better) and boar's bristles in lieu of needles. And a certain deft hand applying just the right amount of tightening.

Nice looking shoes, BTW.

 

[Alan Bee]

A little bit of distraction from the fisticuffs

Toward the end of last year (2018), I commissioned 3 semi-bespoke cap toe Oxfords, all in Burgundy antique, from three different makers. All done on “modified standard” lasts to varying degrees.

And the candidates are in. Who did it best?

1. St. Crispins Model 522B (design modified)
2. GC Cleverley’s Anthony Cleverly Nakagawa
3. Edward Green Cadogan 202C Last



Alan Bee

 

[DWFII]

"Who did it best?" Or "Which looks the best?"

"Who did it best" is not objectively answerable without knowing how the shoes are made...inside and out.

Both the "who" and the "which" are unanswerable given that the photos are not all from the same perspective and not amenable to to fair and balanced comparison.

Maybe the better question is "Which do you like the best?"

 

[ntempleman]

Quite obviously, I'm not Nicholas, but, IMO, the apron seams on the red pair "require more level of expertise/time to execute".

The 'technical' term for the apron stitch is "split and lift." The toe is closed by a "round stitch" on the fleshside.

Wot he said

 

[Alan Bee]

"Who did it best?" Or "Which looks the best?"

"Who did it best" is not objectively answerable without knowing how the shoes are made...inside and out.

Both the "who" and the "which" are unanswerable given that the photos are not all from the same perspective and not amenable to to fair and balanced comparison.

Maybe the better question is "Which do you like the best?"

True about the presentation. The Cleverley was shot by Cleverley (more professional). The others on my iPhone (not so professional(

I’ll discuss fit and construction once the votes are in .....

Alan Bee

 

[patrickBOOTH]

What have I missed? I have been on vacation where I was tricked into hiking up a mountain wearing Saint Crispins oxfords (very sweaty).

 

[Stefan88]

@Alan Bee

I agree with @DWFII. The important thing here is which you like the best.
They're all made to orders with very different styles. I prefer the look of the Edward Green, but then again I like the shorter 202. Subjective.
Did you go for the bespoke option of Saint Crispin's with fitting guarantee, or personal last with adaptions?

The GCs remind me of Ramon Cuberta. Looks like nice, finishing. Did you check if you won the Willy Wonka bespoke treatment?

 

[Zapasman]

Quite obviously, I'm not Nicholas, but, IMO, the apron seams on the red pair "require more level of expertise/time to execute".

The 'technical' term for the apron stitch is "split and lift." The toe is closed by a "round stitch" on the fleshside.

They're both done by hand. To do correctly, both seams generally want a small awl (the smaller the better) and boar's bristles in lieu of needles. And a certain deft hand applying just the right amount of tightening.

Nice looking shoes, BTW.

Thanks you both, that is what I thought. But, what are the insights of the different techniques involved?. Why is more difficult to achive one over the other ("Pie Crust or Round Stitch" Vs "Split & Lift" ) and takes more time to execute ?. Does the use of a thin leather affect the execution of any of both techniques ?.

 

[ecwy]

Since we are talking about split toe aprons, actually one thing I like about bespoke orders is that I can often influence the pattern design somewhat. I sometimes wonder if bespoke makers find it annoying/more work or do they relish the challenge since they should logically be drafting a pattern from scratch on the last.

Personally speaking, my favourite split toe pattern is the one by TYE shoemaker where I believe there is no back seam (at least if the communication/translation was correct). In any case, I wanted a decorative chain stitch vamp apron (a la ntempleman) so I had to settle for a back seam with no split toe seam.

 

[bdavro23]

A little bit of distraction from the fisticuffs

Toward the end of last year (2018), I commissioned 3 semi-bespoke cap toe Oxfords, all in Burgundy antique, from three different makers. All done on “modified standard” lasts to varying degrees.

And the candidates are in. Who did it best?

1. St. Crispins Model 522B (design modified)
2. GC Cleverley’s Anthony Cleverly Nakagawa
3. Edward Green Cadogan 202C Last

View attachment 1204220 View attachment 1204221 View attachment 1204222 View attachment 1204223 View attachment 1204224 View attachment 1204225 View attachment 1204226 View attachment 1204227 View attachment 1204228

Alan Bee

Personally, I like the St. Crispin the best from the pictures. I just think the shape and detailing fits my eye the best. I dont like the cap on the Cleverly, and the EG looks a little squatty to me. With that said, I am curious which one you like best, both from a style standpoint, but more importantly from a fit standpoint. As someone who has struggle to get a good fit in dress shoes most of my life, I am truly envious.

On a related but tangential note, as a small business owner in the luxury (I suppose) space, my goal in life is to find a customer (many) like you!

I cant say that even if money were not a concern that I would order three pairs of expensive shoes that are so similar in color and design. But as an internet style nerd, I have to say that I'm happy you did! Thanks for posting

 

[DWFII]

Thanks you both, that is what I thought. But, what are the insights of the different techniques involved?. Why is more difficult to achive one over the other ("Pie Crust or Round Stitch" Vs "Split & Lift" ) and takes more time to execute ?. Does the use of a thin leather affect the execution of any of both techniques ?.

With a round stitch the awl splits the leather edges of both pieces to be joined. It never goes all the way through. If you think about it, you can see that there is a seam on the toe. And if you look carefully, you can see that the edges are butted up against each other. Edge to edge. So, if the stitching is visible/proud on one side but not the other, it follows that the stitches must lie in the center of the substance (thickness).

Is that clear? If not, I can probably come up with an illustration (even if I have to make it).

Split and lift is a variation of all 'skin stitching'. It starts like a round stitch--the awl penetrating the surface of the apron and emerging at the edge. Ideally, right in the center of the substance..every stitch. Then the awl penetrates the entire substance of the sides of the vamp, entering on the fleshside and emerging on the grain side--straight shot through the leather.

It requires more than a little focused attention to do either of these techniques and it certainly takes more time both in preparation and in execution just because of that. Keeping the awl, and consequently the stitches themselves, as precisely in the center of the substance of the leather as possible is no easy task. And of course not every leather is firm enough to hold up during this process esp. if the maker does not adapt his thread weight appropriately or if he doesn't know how to use boars bristles properly.

As good or not so good as this explanation might be, to really understand, you have to have been there.

?

PS (on edit) ...FWIW, a round stitched seam, done correctly and in good leather is considered the strongest seam known to man.