Norcal's $1000 PC Build. Please Do Enter

[NorCal]



I also find this rather funny:

Actually, the Zalman retails for $40 and the CM Hyper 212 EVO (the exact model the OP claims to have) retails for $35
Searching sale prices currently online, I found the Zalman at $34 and the CM at $24

Claims? Is my honesty in question?
Anyway, don't stop now gentlemen, nerd fights rule!

 

[whiteslashasian]

http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2419&page=5

The Hyper 212 Plus (older version of the 212 EVO, I bought mine for $20.63 on amazon on Dec 17th 2011) out performs the CNPS9700 and the CNPS9900 (both of which greatly outperform your 9500, damn that got SPANKED).

Is that enough evidence for you? Oh look at that, it cools better while running quieter too. Shocking.

Here's another well regarded PC enthusiast and review site tests which have it beating out a Prolimatech Megahelms and Noctua NF-P12-1300 fan at max speed combo (not push-pull), widely considered to be the best air cooler of all time:



The only way you'd have "overheating" issues using a 212 is if you overclocked to ridiculous speeds (4.8 ghz and upward), if it was improperly mounted, TIM applied incorrectly, or the item was defective and needed to be exchanged.

You can also add another CM Blademaster fan to the set up, creating a push-pull system which would increase performance even further. CM 212 wins. Just stop. :foo:

Direct Heatpipes > Cu > Al

 

[furo]



http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2419&page=5
The Hyper 212 Plus (older version of the 212 EVO, I bought mine for $20.63 on amazon on Dec 17th 2011) out performs the CNPS9700 and the CNPS9900 (both of which greatly outperform your 9500, damn that got SPANKED).
Is that enough evidence for you? Oh look at that, it cools better while running quieter too. Shocking.
Here's another well regarded PC enthusiast and review site tests which have it beating out a Prolimatech Megahelms and Noctua NF-P12-1300 fan at max speed combo (not push-pull), widely considered to be the best air cooler of all time:

The only way you'd have "overheating" issues using a 212 is if you overclocked to ridiculous speeds (4.8 ghz and upward), if it was improperly mounted, TIM applied incorrectly, or the item was defective and needed to be exchanged.
You can also add another CM Blademaster fan to the set up, creating a push-pull system which would increase performance even further. CM 212 wins. Just stop. :foo:
Direct Heatpipes > Cu > Al

/yawn

You take your single web test to the bank.

I'll take my chances with the system that got 84% approval from over 1000 reviews proven over a six year period, compared to the CM EVO, a new and fairly untested system with 280ish reviews at 84% approval. By the way, the non EVO Cooler Master Hyper 212, with 2700 reviews, has a lower aggregate approval than the Zalman (78% vs 83%)

 

[whiteslashasian]



/yawn
You take your single web test to the bank.
I'll take my chances with the system that got 84% approval from over 1000 reviews proven over a six year period, compared to the CM EVO, a new and fairly untested system with 280ish reviews at 84% approval. By the way, the non EVO Cooler Master Hyper 212, with 2700 reviews, has a lower aggregate approval than the Zalman (78% vs 83%)

Those were two separate websites and reviews, actually, if you bothered to take a look. There were more but I didn't want to waste more time. Sure it's great to take amateur reviews into account, but ALWAYS with a grain of salt because if you actually read those reviews, there are a TON of idiots who don't know what they're doing and even more so when the sample size increases that much. I do have to say that the Zalman mounting system is pretty fool proof and I can see how an idiot will get confused with the CM, that is likely the cause of most of the negative reviews.

Numbers don't lie but people tend to. At least I've done my research and know for a fact that I made the right purchase and gave the correct advice considering the circumstances.

In short I'll gladly save $20-40, have a quieter system that cools better (fact), and that I personally know will work without a hitch since I have three of them running in various systems I've built over the last year.

Also, have fun cleaning out that zalman after a year. They're a ***** if you want to do it properly.

 

[furo]



Those were two separate websites and reviews, actually, if you bothered to take a look. There were more but I didn't want to waste more time. Sure it's great to take amateur reviews into account, but ALWAYS with a grain of salt because if you actually read those reviews, there are a TON of idiots who don't know what they're doing and even more so when the sample size increases that much. I do have to say that the Zalman mounting system is pretty fool proof and I can see how an idiot will get confused with the CM, that is likely the cause of most of the negative reviews.
Numbers don't lie but people tend to. At least I've done my research and know for a fact that I made the right purchase and gave the correct advice considering the circumstances.
In short I'll gladly save $20-40, have a quieter system that cools better (fact), and that I personally know will work without a hitch since I have three of them running in various systems I've built over the last year.
Also, have fun cleaning out that zalman after a year. They're a ***** if you want to do it properly.

lol, save $20 to $40?

You mean more like $10

I even showed you what the current going rates are on sale. The MSRP for both are within $5, check the links yourself.

Cleaning is easy. My dyson vacuum has a tool which makes dust removal from the entire PC a cakewalk. Other smaller particles I'm not worried about. Until I see a decrease in performance, I'm not going to waste any considerable amount of time cleaning or dismounting it.

Performance on MY PC is what matters, not some chart on a website. And that's what most of those reviewers base their ratings on. Sure there are some crybabies on there who can't turn a screwdriver to save their life, but the reviews are important to consider.

And when it comes to performance, every core of my cpu is currently running between -1 to 2 deg C over ambient temp, and when running Rift on ultra in a full raid environment, I'm barely pushing 7-8deg C over ambient

So, I'll leave it at that.

 

[whiteslashasian]



lol, save $20 to $40?
You mean more like $10
I even showed you what the current going rates are on sale. The MSRP for both are within $5, check the links yourself.
Cleaning is easy. My dyson vacuum has a tool which makes dust removal from the entire PC a cakewalk. Other smaller particles I'm not worried about. Until I see a decrease in performance, I'm not going to waste any considerable amount of time cleaning or dismounting it.
Performance on MY PC is what matters, not some chart on a website. And that's what most of those reviewers base their ratings on. Sure there are some crybabies on there who can't turn a screwdriver to save their life, but the reviews are important to consider.
And when it comes to performance, every core of my cpu is currently running between -1 to 2 deg C over ambient temp, and when running Rift on ultra in a full raid environment, I'm barely pushing 7-8deg C over ambient
So, I'll leave it at that.

Those links weren't for the correct product. The EVO is unnecessarily expensive (not sure why you're fixated on the EVO), considering you can get the equally performing 212 Plus for $20 (free shipping, amazon is at 25 now, but there are other legit sources at 20)

So $44 after shipping for the 9500? Well tigerdirect has it for $38 after shipping, so I guess I missed the $20 mark. The 9700 and 9900 perform more on the level of the 212 but are also more expensive.

Vacuums around electronics are a no-no. But I guess you never learned the hard way. I never did, but would rather avoid it if at all possible, I did have a water incident during a party which I'd also rather not have to experience again.

What Proc are you running? Rift (like most MMO's) was designed to run on the widest variety of PC's therefore having fairly low system and CPU requirements. Something like BF3 or better yet a CPU benchmarking utility (prime95, OCCT, etc) will truly stress your CPU and Cooler to the limit which is when the absolute performance of your cooler will stand out. The 9500 is FINE, I'm not saying it isn't a servicable cooler. Just saying that the CM 212+ offers a far greater performance for dollar in comparison (as I keep showing you), which is how I base all my technology purchases, sadly most enthusiasts are "Fanboys" in one way or another. I don't care who makes it, so long as the performance is there (and documented, not anonymous people saying "cools good man") and the value is right.

 

[furo]



Those links weren't for the correct product. The EVO is unnecessarily expensive (not sure why you're fixated on the EVO), considering you can get the equally performing 212 Plus for $20 (free shipping, amazon is at 25 now, but there are other legit sources at 20)
So $44 after shipping for the 9500? Well tigerdirect has it for $38 after shipping, so I guess I missed the $20 mark. The 9700 and 9900 perform more on the level of the 212 but are also more expensive.
Vacuums around electronics are a no-no. But I guess you never learned the hard way. I never did, but would rather avoid it if at all possible, I did have a water incident during a party which I'd also rather not have to experience again.
What Proc are you running? Rift (like most MMO's) was designed to run on the widest variety of PC's therefore having fairly low system and CPU requirements. Something like BF3 or better yet a CPU benchmarking utility (prime95, OCCT, etc) will truly stress your CPU and Cooler to the limit which is when the absolute performance of your cooler will stand out. The 9500 is FINE, I'm not saying it isn't a servicable cooler. Just saying that the CM 212+ offers a far greater performance for dollar in comparison (as I keep showing you), which is how I base all my technology purchases, sadly most enthusiasts are "Fanboys" in one way or another. I don't care who makes it, so long as the performance is there (and documented, not anonymous people saying "cools good man") and the value is right.

The links are in fact the correct product and exactly what the OP put down as his cooler, the CM Hyper 212 EVO, scroll up....

I have a special attachment for the vacuum, so I'm not worried at all about the dangers.

Rift running in Ultra graphics mode with full raid environment is as heavy a proc as I'll ever be running, so that's what I benchmark on. Also run Skyrim in full ultra mode which may actually be more intense, will have to verify though... haven't played either game in a while.

 

[whiteslashasian]



The links are in fact the correct product and exactly what the OP put down as his cooler, the CM Hyper 212 EVO, scroll up....
I have a special attachment for the vacuum, so I'm not worried at all about the dangers.
Rift running in Ultra graphics mode with full raid environment is as heavy a proc as I'll ever be running, so that's what I benchmark on. Also run Skyrim in full ultra mode which may actually be more intense, will have to verify though... haven't played either game in a while.

I never recommended the EVO and only ever mentioned it in response to you. Norcal may have purchased the EVO but that has no bearing on the fact that the 212 Plus is the best value and performer out any cooler out there right now. The 9500 sure was the top of the top back in 2006 or whenever it was introduced (hence the high reviews, but look at the dates, those people are running AMD FX X2 chips), but times have changed and the cooling technology has moved on. I'm not sure how you can argue that anything beats the performance/$ of the 212 Plus other than some third-hand information with no proof.

Special attachment or no, I wouldn't want to risk that static electricity build up caused by vacuum suction to be discharged on my components. An air compressor with a moisture filter or an electric blower are the ideal PC cleaning tools. For fans I like to use a paint or cheap toothbrush (the kind you get complementary at a hotel) to brush off the caked on dust.

Actually since I changed all the intakes on my Lian Li PC-V2000 II to the modules with dust filters in each, the accumulation within my case has been very, very small. It runs pretty much 24/7 and I'm very happy with the lack of dust buildup inside. I also keep a positive air pressure with 4 intakes and only two exhausts which helps to ensure that all air coming in is passing through the filters rather than finding a way in through joints and cracks.

 

[furo]



I never recommended the EVO and only ever mentioned it in response to you. Norcal may have purchased the EVO but that has no bearing on the fact that the 212 Plus is the best value and performer out any cooler out there right now. The 9500 sure was the top of the top back in 2006 or whenever it was introduced (hence the high reviews, but look at the dates, those people are running AMD FX X2 chips), but times have changed and the cooling technology has moved on. I'm not sure how you can argue that anything beats the performance/$ of the 212 Plus other than some third-hand information with no proof.
Special attachment or no, I wouldn't want to risk that static electricity build up caused by vacuum suction to be discharged on my components. An air compressor with a moisture filter or an electric blower are the ideal PC cleaning tools. For fans I like to use a paint or cheap toothbrush (the kind you get complementary at a hotel) to brush off the caked on dust.
Actually since I changed all the intakes on my Lian Li PC-V2000 II to the modules with dust filters in each, the accumulation within my case has been very, very small. It runs pretty much 24/7 and I'm very happy with the lack of dust buildup inside. I also keep a positive air pressure with 4 intakes and only two exhausts which helps to ensure that all air coming in is passing through the filters rather than finding a way in through joints and cracks.

The 212 Plus won't be selling in 6 years. Because it's an inferior build of cheaper materials. There's an underlying reason you can find one for $20 ya know....

Do you see folks still buying the Cooler Master that was made in 2006?

No.

Do you see many who still buy the Zalman 9500?

Yes.

There's a reason for that, and it's nothing to do with blind luck or ignorant customers.

As far as blowers go, I have one of those electric blowers. It was a total waste of money, all it does is move the dirt around.

Suction is the only way to go, bar none. Static electricity??... lol.... ok

I never run my rig 24/7. Ever. It gets used only when I'm on it (maybe 5 hours a day), and all other times it is completely shut down. I've transitioned to this mode prior to building my rig, after listening to several experienced PC builders tell me the success and horror stories of regular shutdowns vs power saver modes, not to mention the vast difference in lifespan of most major components.

 

[whiteslashasian]



The 212 Plus won't be selling in 6 years. Because it's an inferior build of cheaper materials. There's an underlying reason you can find one for $20 ya know....
Do you see folks still buying the Cooler Master that was made in 2006?
No.
Do you see many who still buy the Zalman 9500?
Yes.
There's a reason for that, and it's nothing to do with blind luck or ignorant customers.
As far as blowers go, I have one of those electric blowers. It was a total waste of money, all it does is move the dirt around.
Suction is the only way to go, bar none. Static electricity??... lol.... ok
I never run my rig 24/7. Ever. It gets used only when I'm on it (maybe 5 hours a day), and all other times it is completely shut down. I've transitioned to this mode prior to building my rig, after listening to several experienced PC builders tell me the success and horror stories of regular shutdowns vs power saver modes, not to mention the vast difference in lifespan of most major components.

Go check out overclock.net. or hardforum.com (not Appreciation ) which are like styleforum for PC nerds. Ask them what they would rather have cooling their top of the line CPU's. I'm sure it's already been done, go ahead a look. Again, like SF, those forums should be taken with a grain of salt, you know how internet nerds can get.

Not saying that I never shut down (I do when I leave for a weekend or for travel) and I usually reboot a few times a week, but I've experienced no issues with running a system for long periods of time other than an occasional fan dying, however I have never used any stand-by or hibernate modes other than monitors shutting off and HDD's powering down when not used. I still have a HDD running in my machine from a build I did in 2005. I have other components in PC's I've handed down to my parents etc which are still running strong after 5-6 years.

Fanboys are fanboys. I know some people who still swear by the Zalman all copper "flower" coolers which I left behind 5 years ago. Just because people still purchase them doesn't mean they're the best item out there. Like I said, solid and servicable, but not the best. The 212 has more reviews than the 9500 in less than half the time. Are you calling all these people stupid and ignorant? Numbers again, do not lie. More reviews, better cooling, and quieter. Why is that so hard to understand? Besides, this isn't a motor vehicle or item that is used in extreme conditions, it's mostly non-moving and makes no difference if it's Copper or Aluminum in terms of longevity, in fact my all copper Zalman 7500 has quite a bit of oxidation on it though I doubt that really hurts performance, just looks ugly. The milling may not be as precise and the solder joints not as pretty, but I've had three of my 212's running for the past year without a hitch after multiple tear downs and apartment moves, no quality issues here, and it will still outperform your dated 9500, good luck when your fan dies.

The 212 is just a stopgap solution on my main rig anyways. Moving to a watercooling loop with a 480mm radiator to cool a CPU and two GPU's when some new items hit the shelves.

I suppose you don't think static electricity exists or can wipe out a computer. I hope you never have to find out the hard way. I've had inexperienced friends kill their systems from vacuuming and in one case having the computer in too dry of an environment (Chicago winter) where his socks rubbing on carpet caused enough static electrical charge that when he touched his PC to power on, he discharged and fried his brand new box. Keep your delusional beliefs and notions. Any rational person reading this exchange can look up the professional reviews and see for themselves which is the best option. I'm done here.

 

[furo]



Fanboys are fanboys. I know some people who still swear by the Zalman all copper "flower" coolers which I left behind 5 years ago. Just because people still purchase them doesn't mean they're the best item out there. Like I said, solid and servicable, but not the best. The 212 has more reviews than the 9500 in less than half the time. Are you calling all these people stupid and ignorant? Numbers again, do not lie. More reviews, better cooling, and quieter. Why is that so hard to understand? Besides, this isn't a motor vehicle or item that is used in extreme conditions, it's mostly non-moving and makes no difference if it's Copper or Aluminum in terms of longevity, in fact my all copper Zalman 7500 has quite a bit of oxidation on it though I doubt that really hurts performance, just looks ugly. The milling may not be as precise and the solder joints not as pretty, but I've had three of my 212's running for the past year without a hitch after multiple tear downs and apartment moves, no quality issues here, and it will still outperform your dated 9500, good luck when your fan dies.
The 212 is just a stopgap solution on my main rig anyways. Moving to a watercooling loop with a 480mm radiator to cool a CPU and two GPU's when some new items hit the shelves.
I suppose you don't think static electricity exists or can wipe out a computer. I hope you never have to find out the hard way. I've had inexperienced friends kill their systems from vacuuming and in one case having the computer in too dry of an environment (Chicago winter) where his socks rubbing on carpet caused enough static electrical charge that when he touched his PC to power on, he discharged and fried his brand new box. Keep your delusional beliefs and notions. Any rational person reading this exchange can look up the professional reviews and see for themselves which is the best option. I'm done here.

More reviews because as you said, you can find one for $20 and everyone looks at price first and foremost. But look at the quality of those reviews. 78% for the 212 Plus compared to 83% for the Zalman, which has been tried and tested for over six years running now.

You didn't respond to the real issue though: why do you think Cooler Master can sell this part for a measley $20? There's a reason. You also didn't answer why you don't see people buying Cooler Master systems made in 2005-2006 compared to the Zalman 9500. Any reason that might be?

Trust me I know all about static electricity. It's just comical that you think I'd be discharging onto my PC. I work part time in a materials engineering lab where I have to wear ESD safe clothing and grounding straps on a regular basis, while handling circuit boards that cost over $100k each. So I know a thing or two about this topic.

 

[skitlets]



lol, save $20 to $40?
You mean more like $10
I even showed you what the current going rates are on sale. The MSRP for both are within $5, check the links yourself.
Cleaning is easy. My dyson vacuum has a tool which makes dust removal from the entire PC a cakewalk. Other smaller particles I'm not worried about. Until I see a decrease in performance, I'm not going to waste any considerable amount of time cleaning or dismounting it.
Performance on MY PC is what matters, not some chart on a website. And that's what most of those reviewers base their ratings on. Sure there are some crybabies on there who can't turn a screwdriver to save their life, but the reviews are important to consider.
And when it comes to performance, every core of my cpu is currently running between -1 to 2 deg C over ambient temp, and when running Rift on ultra in a full raid environment, I'm barely pushing 7-8deg C over ambient
So, I'll leave it at that.

if you think an air cooler can really get you close to ambient temperature. Those onboard sensors are not accurate at all.

 

[whiteslashasian]



if you think an air cooler can really get you close to ambient temperature. Those onboard sensors are not accurate at all.

He still has yet to give us any info on his system. Most Wolfdale chips had notoriously bad temp sensors (among other procs and mobos). My Xeon E3110 reported below ambient temps on Core 0. My Scythe Mini Ninja Rev B is the best cooler ever made!!!!11!

 

[furo]



I'm done here.

He still has yet to give us any info on his system. Most Wolfdale chips had notoriously bad temp sensors (among other procs and mobos). My Xeon E3110 reported below ambient temps on Core 0. My Scythe Mini Ninja Rev B is the best cooler ever made!!!!11!

 

[furo]



Those onboard sensors are not accurate at all.

As opposed to what? I have an MSI P67A-G45 mobo so if you have any ideas on better sensors, let's hear em. Not trolling either... I'll buy a better sensor package if there's one readily available