Law Schools - Where and Why?

[randomkoreandude]

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/if-y...tm_campaign=Feed:+abovethelaw+(Above+the+Law)

abl keeps it real as always ... and tries real hard to be funny

 

[closetmess]



yikes

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/bayl...-of-entire-admitted-class-data-that-weve-got/

Now with race stats! Suck it neo-cons!

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/the-baylor-law-data-dump-now-with-race-and-scholarships/

 

[Kid Nickels]

having read both of your previous posts' links (closet & random) I'm not sure if these articles are serious or not. I've actually never read this website

 

[randomkoreandude]

Website is real lol

It's a must read for most law students and some big law lower level associates

It's essentially a gossip blog on all things legal with a lame sense of humor and sarcasm

 

[DLester]



I'm not sure if these articles are serious or not.

After reading that article, I am not sure either haha.

Is this like The Onion for lawyers?

 

[nerdykarim]

Seriously?

It's like Dealbreaker, but for lawyers.

 

[closetmess]



Seriously?

It's like Dealbreaker, but for lawyers.

+1

 

[ShoeShopperJ]

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/if-y...tm_campaign=Feed:+abovethelaw+(Above+the+Law)
abl keeps it real as always ... and tries real hard to be funny

Excellent article, and it is true. I try to warn people here-and-there, but especially in real life:

Finished MBA: multiple job offers.

Finished law school: private sector job offers to do "loan modifications," consumer bankruptcies without benefits. An aside: those attorney profiles on law firm websites with the fancy suits, many do not have benefits and are paid based on unusual commission schemes by money that THEY bring in and a small portion of the hourly charge without benefits.

During law school: volunteered (no salary or benefits) with government.

During business school: full tuition, free apartment, salary, full benefits, among other perks, from employer.

The difference, I swear to God, could not be more stark. For some---and truly for some reason that eludes me---I always wanted to attend law school. Law school is bull ****, overpriced, and you ironically do not learn how to P R A C T I C E law.

I try to be fair and honest in my warnings about law school. I do believe, now, post-2011, that only idiots are applying to law school.

If it is your dream to practice law and you have a job lined up prior to attending law school, then go and pursue and fulfill your dream. Otherwise, the opportunities with respect to risk of a lifetime of student loan debt and scarce job opportunities makes it an absolutely awful decision to attend law school.

I wish, truly, that I had read this post prior to my decision to attend law school. Please take notice that the "job statistics" about law school graduates are totally false.

 

[freddych]

I just want to chime in as a fairly recent graduate of law school and someone who is confronted fairly often with the "Should I go to law school?" question:

ShoeShopperJ's harsh reality applies to the vast majority of the entire universe of law students graduating from any law school in the US. That said, when you start to break it down on a school by school level, you see a divide happening and a not-so-stark future.

If you attend one of the top law schools in the nation (and by top I mean somewhere in the top 14 schools, AKA the T14 according to USNWR), the chances are very good that you will be starting out your career at a large law firm making anywhere from 120K to 160K a year to start, plus benefits and bonus. There is high demand for law students graduating from the top law schools. As long as you dont completely fk your grades up, and lets face it, with grade inflation the way it is, its pretty hard to, you're going to get a well paying job.

That said, job prospects are much worse for those outside of the T14. You'll find at a 50-100 ranked law school, think Fordham, that does especially well for a law school of its rank because of its location in NYC (where many of the BIGLAW jobs are), you have to be in the top 5-10% to be considered for many law firms. Another thing I want to add: students who don't make it into a T14 school typically thing they will just kick ass the first year and then transfer to a better school are in for a huge surprise: there is a general practice of putting high performing scholarship students into the same small sections, forcing them to compete with each other on the grade curve, thus preventing many students from excelling and eventually transferring out.

So here's my advice: going to law school should be a decision that should be made after you figure out what law schools you get into. If you get into a T14 school (and you want to be a lawyer) you can rest easy to know that if you do adequately, you will have a job waiting for you when you graduate. If you don't, please for the love of god don't take on 100K+ in debt for the slim chance of placing in the top 5-10%.

 

[Gibonius]

So I'm not a lawyer, have no interest in going to law school, but I had a question: You always see T14 referred to. Is there really a significant dropoff after 14? Is Cornell that much better than UCLA (14 and 15 this year), or is this just an arbitrary cutoff?

 

[randomkoreandude]

its just like any other cut off. top 10 is always the best but its just a number. number 11 is technically just as good but to everyone else, top 10 is always better than number 11.

with law, we have top 14 not top 10. from my understanding every single school in the top 14 has NEVER dropped lower than 14 since the us news began ranking law schools. at the same time, every school in the top 14 has at least once been in the top 10. up till last year, no other school has ever broken into the top 14 since the beginning of the rankings (obvi this was all messed up by Texas breaking into the t14 last year but has now been dropped back to its former spot)

 

[bartleby929]

There have been studies that have been shown that consumers who apply for credit cards and such are HUGELY and DISPROPORTIONATELY optimistic about being able to pay off what they owe. My consumer law professor says this all the time (because it is his life work) and then throws in that law school is the same thing.

90% of your class goes in thinking they will be in the top 10%. 10% of the class goes in just happy to be there. 90% of the class will not be in the top 10%.

GL all. Take the most money at the best regional school you can get into. I have a full scholarship at a strong regional school and still might drop out next winter if I strike out at OCIs.

 

[Gibonius]



its just like any other cut off. top 10 is always the best but its just a number. number 11 is technically just as good but to everyone else, top 10 is always better than number 11.
with law, we have top 14 not top 10. from my understanding every single school in the top 14 has NEVER dropped lower than 14 since the us news began ranking law schools. at the same time, every school in the top 14 has at least once been in the top 10. up till last year, no other school has ever broken into the top 14 since the beginning of the rankings (obvi this was all messed up by Texas breaking into the t14 last year but has now been dropped back to its former spot)

Thanks, the relative stasis of the rankings makes the number a little more meaningful.

In the sciences you have "Tier 1" institutes, but that's a much more flexible metric since it doesn't distinguish exactly how many are in Tier 1.

 

[freddych]

Yes. There actually is a big difference between Georgetown at 14 and UCLA/Texas which trade off at 15 from time to time. UCLA does well in Cali firms, Texas does well at Texas firms, but if what you want is to break into a large firm in NYC, G-town is much much better than either school for reasons that are unclear to me.

 

[freddych]

I also want to add: be wary of scholarships that require some sort of GPA to maintain. I've heard of schools with scholarships that require 3.5 GPA to maintain them after the first semester. Little do the students know, that you have to be in the top 20% of the class to get a 3.5, and on top of that, they give the scholarship to 30% of the class. And then further making it harder to keep the scholarship, they put all the scholarship kids in the same small section (and in the same classes) so they are competing against each other to keep their scholarship.