I’m Doubting Alden’s Future

[Epaulet]

Former Alden retailer who visited their factory two times checking in:

It's worth nothing that Alden has two people at the end of the line with the express job of checking and packing each pair of shoes and boots. Their stations have a magnifying glass to look through.

Their job description is to look at every part of the shoe, inside and out, and control for the very errors that you see too much of.

So when you get a pair of shoes with obvious defects... those were absolutely examined and evaluated. It was a conscious decision to allow them to be put into a box and sent as 1st quality product for their clients.

They do pull units to be fixed or remade or sent to Shoe Mart.

But someone examined Benjamin831's full price cordovan loafers and thought "f--k it, let's just send these." This wasn't an accident and this wasn't something that just got overlooked.

Humans do make mistakes and this happens to some degree at every factory. But I'll say that it happened more at Alden than with any other shoe factory that I've ever worked with.

Although, as Clee1982 said, the overall American Ivy styling is very hard to find anywhere else. And for many clients, the fit works wonderfully.

 

[Texasmade]

Former Alden retailer who visited their factory two times checking in:

It's worth nothing that Alden has two people at the end of the line with the express job of checking and packing each pair of shoes and boots. Their stations have a magnifying glass to look through.

Their job description is to look at every part of the shoe, inside and out, and control for the very errors that you see too much of.

So when you get a pair of shoes with obvious defects... those were absolutely examined and evaluated. It was a conscious decision to allow them to be put into a box and sent as 1st quality product for their clients.

They do pull units to be fixed or remade or sent to Shoe Mart.

But someone examined Benjamin831's full price cordovan loafers and thought "f--k it, let's just send these." This wasn't an accident and this wasn't something that just got overlooked.

Humans do make mistakes and this happens to some degree at every factory. But I'll say that it happened more at Alden than with any other shoe factory that I've ever worked with.

Although, as Clee1982 said, the overall American Ivy styling is very hard to find anywhere else. And for many clients, the fit works wonderfully.

Could be worse. Imagine spending like $6,000+ on some bespoke John Lobb SJ shoes with every pair supposedly inspected by one of the Lobbs before being delivered to the customer only to have very obvious flaws and defects similar to what you see with Alden. Someone posted a recent example of this on some boots in the bespoke shoe thread.

 

[Epaulet]

Could be worse. Imagine spending like $6,000+ on some bespoke John Lobb SJ shoes with every pair supposedly inspected by one of the Lobbs before being delivered to the customer only to have very obvious flaws and defects similar to what you see with Alden. Someone posted a recent example of this on some boots in the bespoke shoe thread.

Very true. You could also change $6000 to $80000 and "John Lobb" to "Tesla" and you'd have a pretty solid take on this thing:

 

[clee1982]

I see a cyber truck near work everyday the miss align panel makes me want to take a hammer to it...

 

[Epaulet]

I see a cyber truck near work everyday the miss align panel makes me want to take a hammer to it...

My neighborhood in suburban LA is like you died and went to Cybertruck heaven. They are everywhere.

And every single Cybertruck driver looks like a variant of this. The kind of guys who exclusively spring that gourmet coffee **** on everyone.

 

[Blastwice]

The issues with the pair are:

• There is a gouge that cuts into the leather on the upper
  
  • This can easily be filled in with polish and brushed and you'll never see it again. From the looks of the photo you could probably get by by moistening that nick and brushing it out.
• The stitching on heel area is completely severed and frayed, probably by a worker running a knife through it to cut off the cover during production
  
  • This will almost certainly not impact the durability of the shoes. There are tons of nails and glue in that area. In the long term if the heel has a ton of flex (from putting it on and off roughly or bending it unnaturally over and over) this could develop into a tear, but this is a many years of hard wear down the road problem.
• There are errant nail heads protruding near the heels, compromising watertightness
  
  • I would say that whatever issue you have here, don't conflate it with "watertightness". These shoes are not submarines and if you're walking in water, these nails aren't going to make anything better or worse than it already is.
• Sole leather has a large scrape or mark that damaged the surface
  
  • This is the part of the shoe that faces the ground and is meant to be marked up. Sure, they could do a better job, but this is a RTW shoe you are buying.
• General shoddy workmanship throughout.
  
  • Compared to what? This looks like typical Alden quality to me. Wear the shoe and enjoy it. Nobody will ever point out any of these "flaws" to you while you're wearing these shoes, I promise. If they are too much, it might be time to upgrade to a brand that is more expensive and has more attention to the fine details.

Just my opinion. If this is your first Cordovan pair, don't fret. Shell (as well as leather and nails and stitching) is very durable and these shoes will last you a long time.

 

[tuna roll]

Former Alden retailer who visited their factory two times checking in:

It's worth nothing that Alden has two people at the end of the line with the express job of checking and packing each pair of shoes and boots. Their stations have a magnifying glass to look through.

Their job description is to look at every part of the shoe, inside and out, and control for the very errors that you see too much of.

So when you get a pair of shoes with obvious defects... those were absolutely examined and evaluated. It was a conscious decision to allow them to be put into a box and sent as 1st quality product for their clients.

They do pull units to be fixed or remade or sent to Shoe Mart.

But someone examined Benjamin831's full price cordovan loafers and thought "f--k it, let's just send these." This wasn't an accident and this wasn't something that just got overlooked.

Humans do make mistakes and this happens to some degree at every factory. But I'll say that it happened more at Alden than with any other shoe factory that I've ever worked with.

Although, as Clee1982 said, the overall American Ivy styling is very hard to find anywhere else. And for many clients, the fit works wonderfully.

That’s interesting. Based on my experience I’d say they had a robot at the end of the line randomly sending shoes to either TSM Seconds or regular retailers.

In all seriousness, you mentioned you were a retailer. Can retailers send a shoe back to Alden if they inspect it and judge the QC is not adequate? I mean before selling to any client, just as a part of their internal QC. Or is that a fast track to become blacklisted by Alden?

 

[No8]

I just have not had these issues fortunately. Lots of Alden shoes. The additional price as less ideal fit for EG is not enough for me to invest primarily in those. I find the Alden durability to be fantastic. The same styles of cordovan from EG are double the price. To me it’s not worth it. The nail that is off work send that back as clearly should be a seconds.

 

[tuna roll]

I honestly don't mind most of these defects. Love my Aldens. I just don't like that kind of surprise when buying new shoes. Some of the defects I've seen bother me a bit, specially if they are on the upper and not easily fixable. So it's a bit like a russian roulette. These days I prefer buying in person or even second hand as I can see photos of the actual shoe.

 

[Ypuh]

On 2nd thought, not willing to go into discussion .

 

[Epaulet]

That’s interesting. Based on my experience I’d say they had a robot at the end of the line randomly sending shoes to either TSM Seconds or regular retailers.

In all seriousness, you mentioned you were a retailer. Can retailers send a shoe back to Alden if they inspect it and judge the QC is not adequate? I mean before selling to any client, just as a part of their internal QC. Or is that a fast track to become blacklisted by Alden?

In order to make money as an Alden retailer, you need to do special makeups, and you need to do a lot of them in cordovan. That's where the demand really is. It's also where Alden offers - comparitively - the best value.

The opportunity and timing of special makeups depend on your status with Alden. If they like you, you'll get to do more of them. If you're constantly complaining and nitpicking, then you'll get to do less of them. Maybe none of them.

So yes, there's a strong incentive to simply accept the pairs that you're sent and deal with it. That's why most stores simply throw up their hands when a customer justifiably says "how did this pass your inspection?!?!?"

And as you can see in this thread, some people will find certain defects to be unacceptible and others will shrug them off. Both responses are valid. The only thing that matters is if the client ultimately wears and enjoys the shoes.

Alden has been compared to the Harley Davidson of footwear, and I think that's apt. It's a robust American-made product that often has visible defects that you don't see on competitive products from abroad. It has a unique soul that hasn't been duplicated elsewhere though. It's best to appreciate these characteristics as you go into the brand.

 

[AriGold]

Alden is living off their legacy and doing a great job at it too!

If anyone copied the Aberdeen last in narrow I'd switch in a heartbeat, but the Aberdeen last is just the perfect shape for a tassel loafer.

 

[Blastwice]

You have a very low standard for a high quality dress shoe. I mean, I'm not the most nitpicky customer, but the level of quality provided here (not calculating the cordovan) is below what I would expect from Meermin, Barker or Loake at 1/3 of the price or less. Three brands that I've owned and worn with pleasure. I don't even take 'not falling apart' in as a measure, as that should be a given.

Don't take this personally but I can almost get angry for fellow consumers being so ignorant, devaluing any of the issues of which none should be acceptable. It's like a car hitting one of your kids, with some rando saying you should be glad he didn't kill him.

Recently I shared a bad experience with a buyer who bought NOS from me and concluded he was overly picky for a 2nd hand purchase. Accepting shoes such as these Alden's for full price is like the polar opposite.

What an interesting response.

My standards for dress shoes are quite high, which is a reason I don't purchase Alden or RTW shoes of any brand, for that matter. Swing and a miss with your hypothesis there.

So let's break it down since you seem like someone who never purchased raw materials or stepped foot in a workshop or factory before.

Shell costs are pretty much uniform throughout the industry from Horween. Alden most likely gets a better rate on their colors (generally 3 including this one), but even if they are getting a deal on the cordovan their overall cogs is probably relatively high for a few reasons: lack of easy access to shoemaking materials (they almost certainly pay premium for things like nails, laces, sole leather, etc. in the USA where costs should be probably highest anywhere in the world) as well as very high labor costs and lack of specialists (ie. no one is training or dreaming to be on a shoe line in USA from a young age). Horween is also the most expensive shell, so material costs and labor costs on this shoe are very high.

(Alden also recently had $10M stolen from them by their CFO so I'm sure that impacted their bottom line too.)

The defects presented here can be fixed by a cobbler for free and he would buff them up too. But you don't need to even do that because again, cordovan shell and stitching and nails are very durable. Nothing in this shoes is going to fall apart except for a potential long term tearing at the heel like ANY model with this type of stitching could potentially happen.

My advice, as always, if this kind of shoe is "unacceptable" to you, then it's probably time to move up to a brand that has higher QC or is making individual pairs and spends more time on each pair. In a factory setting, these are not defects that are going to a defect bin, because they aren't serious issues at a RTW value proposition.

It's kind of funny to compare Meermin to these. Meermin shoes are much cheaper, much cheaper labor, and have a different spectrum of defects. Have you ever purchased Meermin shoes before?

 

[Ypuh]

Updated my previous post as I prefer not to go into such forum discussions. I revoke my previous statements. Each may decide for their own.

@Epaulet's post above reflects my thoughts perfectly.

 

[clee1982]

Alden is living off their legacy and doing a great job at it too!

If anyone copied the Aberdeen last in narrow I'd switch in a heartbeat, but the Aberdeen last is just the perfect shape for a tassel loafer.

Not a copy and not shell, but kind similar vibe I would take a look at Barbanera, then CJ (325 is not great for me either, 341 is much better for me)

On the dressy side of tassel loafer I think EG and Paolo Scafora are best