Chinos, coat and tie.

radicaldog · Aug 19, 2012

There's a fair amount of discussion of jeans + coat & tie, but what about the above? And I mean non-creased, tendentially wrinkly chinos, not the kind that are basically cotton twill dress trousers. Just one step up from jeans. Post good and bad examples of such combinations, and let's discuss, if you're so inclined. I'm struggling to find any photos that don't feature overly tight clothes and the extremely short coats that are in fashion at the moment.

radicaldog · Aug 19, 2012

Ok, just to make a start:

radicaldog · Aug 19, 2012

Boyer:

DocHolliday · Aug 19, 2012

SF has developed some weird ideas about chinos, but I like them, especially for summer wear. They're effortless in a way even linen can't match.

I do like 'em slim, though. Not skin-tight, but slim and just slightly short, '60s style.

radicaldog · Aug 20, 2012

DocHolliday said:
SF has developed some weird ideas about chinos, but I like them, especially for summer wear. They're effortless in a way even linen can't match.
I do like 'em slim, though. Not skin-tight, but slim and just slightly short, '60s style.

I agree. On SF (MC) there is a strong bias towards more formal clothes. I do chinos (and even jeans) and jacket and tie very often, usually with buttondown shirts and knit ties. In fact I rarely wear wool trousers with coat and tie: it strikes me as somewhat fuddy-duddy, so when that level of formality is in order I go with a suit.

Makoto Chan · Aug 20, 2012

"And I mean non-creased, tendentially wrinkly chinos, not the kind that are basically cotton twill dress trousers."

I wear chinos with a jacket very often, especially in the summer.I try to iron them, like you say (haha): "basically cotton twill dress trousers" - but rumpled isn't bad. It's a good look.

Andrew Ryan · Mar 31, 2014

radicaldog said:
On SF (MC) there is a strong bias towards more formal clothes. I do chinos (and even jeans) and jacket and tie very often, usually with buttondown shirts and knit ties. In fact I rarely wear wool trousers with coat and tie: it strikes me as somewhat fuddy-duddy, so when that level of formality is in order I go with a suit.

Necrothreak, I know, but...

I agree that this is an underutilized look, or at least insofar as represented on SF. I also wear chinos with casual jackets and tie, always with an unfused soft collar BD casual shirt (i.e., OCBDs for solids/stripes, broadcloths for patterns), and penny loafers. I occasionally wear jeans as well, but only colored ones (mostly light grey). I substitute 2.5" solid grenadines for knits with this look because I just can't stand knits (I know, I know) no matter how much I've tried to embrace them.

When I dress it up a bit, I swap the chinos and pennies for either flannels, cotton ('cotton dress trousers') or linen, and break out the wider width ties and sleeker, dressier loafers (usually Alden full-straps). I also trade the OCBD's in for broadcloth or poplin, but keep the soft BD collars (I like my collar roll...); when the level of formality requires/suggests higher (usually when I'm with clients), I break out the spread collars and french cuffs, even wider width ties, worsted suits and balmorals.

I don't think 'wool trousers with coat and tie' is 'somewhat fuddy-duddy', but I do find it impractical (in the social sense) for my day-to-day (when I'm not with clients), which is academia and lab work. Chinos + casual jackets and the right shirts and ties, in the right fabrics and weights and textures, strike a good balance of tailored dress without being overdressed, IMO.

Or at least that's what I tell myself...

Andrew Ryan · Aug 11, 2014

Doin' it right:

Would be good if the collar wasn't a ******* spread:

Would be okay, again, if the collar wasn't a point (see the theme here? maybe I should just say 'if the collar was a button down'):

Would be great if it weren't for the ******* cutaway collar and peak lapeled odd jacket:

A more extreme example, where the fit just doesn't know what it wants to be. More formal odd jacket (blazer, albeit with peak lapels for god knows what reason), ultra casual shirting pattern and color but in a spread collar (and likely broadcloth) format, tie that could be pulled off casually due to width IMO, but isn't due to color... and then there's the waist down.

I've got more pics, but I think the key here is to make sure all other pieces (sportcoat, shirt, tie, shoes) are in the more casual range, and the look can work perfectly. Textured coats with patch pockets, button down collars - sometimes in rougher fabrics, depending on season, either knits or (my preference) relatively matte woven ties (I use 2.5" grenadines) in subdued colors, and loafers, suede, brogues, etc.

It's basically the same way to rock a tie and coat with jeans, guidelines wise. Except it looks much more natural to me - jeans are just a step too far.

YRR92 · Aug 11, 2014

#1 has an awful collar. Sure, a BD collar is better, but that's a bad BD collar.
#2 needs to wear some socks with those shoes.
#3 is wearing jeggings.

We agree on #4 and #5, kinda, but 'cept the monkstraps are too big for his trousers, and make his feet look bit.

Andrew Ryan · Aug 11, 2014

Yeah I definitely prefer a BD collar soft and with some roll. I agree about the socks. Most of these chinos are too tight for my preference. And I only wear loafers with chinos cause I think ANY other shoe makes my feet look too big / disproportionate, so I definitely agree about the monks.

Was just trying to revive the thread and cover some basic principles (IMO).

It's an underutilized look.

YRR92 · Aug 12, 2014

Nah, I dig.

I've worn it probably most of the time this summer. I find I like my chinos narrow, but I think there's a compromise width I like -- basically, for my feet, as slim as I like with oxfords (covering a little between half and a third of the shoe) ends up covering about 1/3 of the loafer, which is the balance I like to strike. But I'm already very slim, and I don't wear my jackets very fitted.

Of course, yesterday I wore very skinny chinos that were barely wider than my ankle, but I also wore a jacket with a cleaner-than-usual chest.

FlyingMonkey · Aug 12, 2014

I often wear jacket and tie with well-cut slim but not tight chinos - I really like PRL's custom ft chinos - in early summer. I find they are too heavy for mid-summer. But I do like my chinos creased. Not denim, obviously, but chinos, yes.

Andrew Ryan · Aug 12, 2014

^ Creased chinos?

To each their own, but if you're going to crease why not just wear cotton trousers...? Seems to defeat the effect.

FlyingMonkey · Aug 12, 2014

Andrew Ryan said:
^ Creased chinos?

To each their own, but if you're going to crease why not just wear cotton trousers...? Seems to defeat the effect.

What 'effect'? I think that is quite a range of really quite different trousers here, when we talk about 'chinos' (or khakis, or indeed, cotton trousers). The PRL custom fit chinos - if you've seen them - are a world away from say, Dockers, which would look pretty dorky if you creased them. In fact, I wouldn't have called the PRL trousers, 'chinos' unless the manufacturer did themselves. I wouldn't press my Engineered Garments cinch chinos - but then those are very different in fabric, finish and cut, a whole different kind of trouser, you might say.

Andrew Ryan · Aug 12, 2014

By effect, I meant that the defining factor of a chino vs a cotton dress pant would be a lack of crease, IMO. Sure, that barely covers the difference, but it does define it well. The OP of this specifically points out this distinction as the kind of crux in discussing chinos with coat and tie. Effect being: a more laid-back, casual jacket and tie fit.

I guess you were just chiming in about cotton pants in general. Not trying to be a dick about it, though, so, yeah, um.... right on, I guess.

Chinos, coat and tie.

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