Suit silhouettes

I have been on this board for a year and some months. The knowledge I have gained can't be measured. A thread was speaking about the different Savile Row tailors. This got me thinking about expanding this whole concept of silhouettes. Much have been spoken about the different cuts each brand and/or tailor has but no unifed post of this matter. If anyone can elaborate on the cut by brand/model/tailor, please add your comments. I think pictures side-by-side would really show for example, the shoulders, armhole, waist suppression, etc, basically the overall concept each of these different suits portray. What I want is when I go for custom, I can use these ideas to express what type of silhouette I am looking for. This idea behind this thread is to explain the different methodologies on creating a suit, how each would work on different physiques

Here are a examples of what I mean if I wasn't clear enough before:

Brioni: Some mentioned it has a cut that has the impression of "Don't f**k with me"

Oxxford: Old money look, less waist suppression.

Brooks Brothers, J Press, Southwick: Sack Suit, American cut, no waist supression.


Obviously, there is more to it then that, like the armholes, shoulders, waist supression, etc and how they work with each other to create a certain look.

Brioni: Some mentioned it has a cut that has the impression of "Don't f**k with me"


I believe I said that. I have classic 2 button Brioni. It has high arm-hole. I do not like other designers nor maker 2 button suits. I tried Armani, Zegna, Canali, Gucci, Dolce .. you name it .. They did not look too great. Thus, I thought I would never look good in 2 button suits, till I tried on my Brioni..

I do not know the look I described is for you, but when I put the Brioni on with white shirt without tie, I mean, I look so bold. No other 2 button thus far created this look. I do not know what it is really. Brioni does have subtaincial padding on shoulders like Canali's do, but the padding really molds on to your shoulder creating real 'tight' look. It creates very sharp image.

Great idea for a thread. It's alot more practical than those "which suit is higher quality/has more hand work" threads.

I bet A Harris has alot to say as well as Tracozaag about shoulders.

Alan Flusser (may his name be damned) does a pretty decent job on the basics here. He essentially breaks down the suit shapes into three basic categories: American, British, and Continental, the first being either the sack or modified sack silhouette, the second (Flusser's preference) being a highly structured silhouette with military shoulders, built up chest piece, and severe waist suppression (the typical British Banker look) and the continental being a slimmer suit with a more natural shoulder, some, but less, waist suppression in than the Bristish model, and a less built up chest piece. Of course, there are variations between these - the Huntsman is significantly different from the Gieves and Hawkes house model, and the Neapolitan jacket is quite different from the Roman model. Anyway, I need lunch, and AHarris is much more qualified to write on this subject anyway.

I would also be interested in some more detailed description (and illustrations) of suit silhouettes. With respect to Flusser's descriptions of suit silhouettes, I've only seen brief overviews of what he calls the European, American, and sack silhouettes. There is little detail and certainly no info or distinction between Neopolitan, British, and Roman styles which I assume are all different in some way or another.

dan

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that was an awesome post, in my view. thanks for the comprehensiveness.

/andrew

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Manton, that was one of the best posts I have ever read..

I have little to add, except maybe I could describe for the board, to the best of my ability, the cuts of some specific makes, if anyone has requests.

A couple of comments - with what I've seen of Flusser's suits, the buttoning position is quite a bit lower and the fit is much looser overall than a Neopolitan suit. A&S lies somewhere between the two, IMO. Relatives for sure, but they aren't all three the same look, in my eye.

And an addition or two to LA Guy's summary of Flusser's categories - the British silhouette does indeed have very military shoulders, but they tend to be fairly unpadded, while the Continental silhouette is marked by a narrow, squarish padded shoulder. And Flusser differentiates between the American sack suit and what he calls the "updated American" suit - which is sort of a British/American hybrid.

Those categories make decent reference points, but in reality, as Manton pointed out, there are a million different variations. And small differences in cut can mean huge differences in how the suit looks.

That was a HOF post Manton, well done.

koji

I was curious where an Oxxford suit fits in. I am not sure who sells them in Toronto and have never looked at one close up. Could someone elaborate on them in the context of what was described above.

Thanks.

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Equipped with neither an encyclopaedic memory nor a laser eye, I think of the cut of a suit as it relates to the torso it covers, either organic or architectural. An organic cut is part of the natural world. It reacts to the natural shape within and to natural forces such as wind and gravity. An architectural cut, by contrast, creates and supports its own shape with only an idealized reference to the wearer.

Knowing which side of the line a suit falls on, you can scrutinize the details at your leisure.

Manton, well put on Brioni. Thats what I wanted to say ^_^

BTW, where does Canali's silhouette falls under this? I find my Canali's have rather big skirts. Can this be fixed by tailor or is this Canali's cut?

Would someone mind to explain what a ravioli shoulder is? Pics would be even better. Thanks.